Appropriations & Oversight Committee — 2025-06-09
Attendance
Cal Finocchiaro ; Mark Garipay ; Ward Hamilton ; Maya Jamaleddine ; Manjula Karamcheti ; Leila Migliorelli ; John Obremski ; Devin Romanul ; Robb Stewart ; Kimberly Vandiver ; Ryan Williams
Agenda
- Call to Order
- Public Comment
- Department Budget Presentations
- Appropriation Request for FY25
- APPRO-2025-40 : An Appropriation from Free Cash (01-324001) in the amount of $90,000 to the Police Department (#211) for the purchase of a new cruiser.
- An Appropriation in the amount of $150,000 from Free Cash to the Affordable Housing Trust (#8270).
- Appropriation Request for FY26
- APPRO-2025-50 : Fiscal Year 2026 Operating Budget in the amount of $107,575,802.
- Ordinances
- Reauthorization of the City of Melrose Revolving Fund Table for Fiscal 2026.
- Orders
- Revoke the provisions of M.G.L. Chapter 44, § 53F½ ceasing the operation of the Ambulance Enterprise Fund, effective Fiscal Year 2026, beginning July 1, 2025.
- Adjournment
Minutes
CITY OF MELROSE APPROPRIATIONS & OVERSIGHT COMMITTEE CALENDAR● JUNE 9, 2025 Council Chamber, First Floor, Melrose City Hall Budget Hearing 7:03 PM 562 Main Street, Melrose, MA 02176 Attendee Name Title Status Arrived Maya Jamaleddine Vice Chair Present Cal Finocchiaro Present Ward Hamilton Present Manjula Karamcheti Present John Obremski Absent Devin Romanul Present Robb Stewart Present Kimberly Vandiver Late 7:04 PM Ryan Williams Present Leila Migliorelli President, Ex Oficio Present Mark Garipay Chair Present
(ID # 12651) Appropriation An Appropriation from Free Cash (01-324001) in the amount of $90,000 to the Police Department (#211) for the purchase of a new cruiser. Ought to Pass City Council
(ID # 12737) Appropriation An Appropriation in the amount of $150,000 from Free Cash to the Affordable Housing Trust (#8270). Ought to Pass City Council
(ID # 12678) Operating Budgets (City, School, Regional School) Fiscal Year 2026 Operating Budget in the amount of $107,575,802. Ought to Pass City Council
(ID # 12675) Revolving Fund/Reauthorization Reauthorization of the City of Melrose Revolving Fund Table for Fiscal 2026. Ought to Pass City Council
(ID # 12670) Enterprise Fund City of Melrose Page 1 6/12/2025 2:02 PM Minutes Appropriations & Oversight Committee June 9, 2025 Revoke the provisions of M.G.L. Chapter 44, § 53F½ ceasing the operation of the Ambulance Enterprise Fund, effective Fiscal Year 2026, beginning July 1, 2025. Ought to Pass City Council City of Melrose Page 2 6/12/2025 2:02 PM
Transcript
▶ 0:01 Mark Garipay: Good evening. The time is 7 0 3 on Thur Thursday, Monday, June 9th. This is the meeting, the Appropriation Oversight Committee. I'm, uh, mark Ape, the chair. Uh, joining me tonight, our Vice Chair, Jamal Ledine, uh, councilor Fanuc, chiro Councilor Stewart, counselor, uh, Ramano Council, Hamilton Counselor Williams, counselor Chetty, and President Melli. This serves as a notice of a quorum for the record in accordance with the Open Meeting law. This meeting is being recorded and broadcast live on MMTV. Uh, I will motion by unanimous consent to open the floor for public comment. Seeing no objections, public comment, portion of the meeting is now open. This is the portion of the meeting where the public may speak to any item on tonight's agenda.
▶ 0:52 Mark Garipay: Comments expressing any viewpoint on the matters are also welcome or any other matters are also welcome. If there's anyone, uh, in attendance that would like to speak, please feel free to come up to the table. State your name and address, seeing no one in the gallery looking to speak. Is there anyone online? No one online. Okay. If there are no objections, I'll motion by unanimous consent to close the public comment portion of the meeting. Seeing no objections, public comment is now closed. We are moving on to our final, final department presentations. Um, so first up, we have Department 6 93 Memorial Hall, and we have with us, uh, Ms. Kathy Pickett, Broder, director of Memorial Hall, and Lou Izzy, um, one of the trustees.
▶ 1:48 I'm not sure your title on the I'm, I don't have a title. So Mary Sexton, who's our chairperson, uh, couldn't make it this evening, so they've asked me to sit in, but also joined by, um, Michael Margolis and Jay Webb, who are also trustees. Hello Floor Trust. Thank you very much. Um, first of all, I wanna thank you for your time tonight. I appreciate you listening and hearing us out. Um, I, as you know, I'm the Executive director and exec operations manager of the Soldiers and Sailors Memorial Building. Um, I want, first off, wanna thank my incredibly hardworking staff who last year executed with me over 259 events with over 48,000 guests to our building as of this morning. And I do it day by day, how many events I have.
▶ 2:34 Um, but as of this morning, I have 203 requests for event dates for fiscal year 26. Um, the Memorial Hall rental rates, um, will increase as of July, 2025. I researched for the trustees. 18 municipal communities surround all our surrounding communities. Um, it took several months, but I researched only municipal owned properties, what their rental rates were, and I presented it to the trustees. They, in turn, took that along with the cost to run Memorial Health, given to us by the CFO to determine the new rates. Uh, great news at Memorial Health for next year is, um, as you have heard, the Mayor's office successfully applied and got a grant from the, and I wanna say it correctly, the Massachusetts Association
▶ 3:21 Planning Council's Technical Assistance Program Program for a strategic planning for Memorial Hall as a regional arts and cultural venue. The grants is worth $95,000, and what it will do is MAP staff will work with city staff to determine the next chapter of Memorial Hall. Um, and what are the options for management of Memorial Hall in the future? Um, the FY 26 budget that you have presented to you, um, represents a reduction in the Memorial Hall salaries, which is a lowering of the, the hours for the Memorial Hall staff, a reduction in the elevator, um, service, annual service plan. That's a mandatory service plan, but it's based on union rates and everything else is level funded. I'm happy to take any questions you have
▶ 4:09 Ward Hamilton: regarding the budget. Uh, council Hamilton, thank you. Thank you for being here tonight. And I have a statement prepared, but before I read it, there is no one in Melrose that doesn't recognize the value of Memorial Hall in the asset that it is in this community, we are a municipality, a city government, a corporation that delivers services to residents funded by their tax dollars. The essential services we deliver are public works, water, sewer, trash, and recycling streets, sidewalks, parks and buildings. That's our infrastructure. Public safety, police and fire and public education. Our school system. During the present budget season, we've heard about dramatic cuts in city services to police,
▶ 5:02 Ward Hamilton: fire and DPW, and we have gutted the school budget simultaneously. We have approved putting an override measure on the ballot in November, signaling to the community our position that we need more of their tax dollars to get the job done. How do we approve the department budget before us when we don't have a city engineer or a facilities director, when we cannot fully fund our police or fire departments the way they deserve to be? And when we are literally laying off dozens of teachers, what are the optics on that? And what is the message we would be sending to the taxpayers? A municipality that operates a non-essential ancillary resource at a loss during a time like this is literally telling the community
▶ 5:59 Mark Garipay: we don't really need an override. And that's the wrong message to be sending. I make a message to, I make a motion to reduce the bottom line of department 6 9 3 Memorial building budget total to $0. We have a motion on the floor by Cons. Hamilton, do we have a second? Second. Second. Okay. So we have a motion on the floor to reduce the Memorial Hall budget, uh, to zero. So that would be reducing it, $215,937, um, made by Council Hamilton, seconded by Council Ro on discussion. Council Romano, I have some thoughts, but first, I, I wanted to ask, um, a question. It, the study that, for which we've applied for the funding from MAPC, is there a timeline, anticipated timeline for, um, execution for, uh,
▶ 6:58 Manjula Karamcheti: getting those policy recommendations? And how might they line up with the City of Melrose's fiscal year? It's going to be exec be done next fiscal year, so it'll be done within the next fiscal year, fiscal year 26, right? Right. So maybe sometime in the spring we'd get a series of recommendations. Great. Um, Okay. Councilor Kahan, Um, I do not have a formal statement present, uh, to give as, uh, councilor Hamilton did, but there's a couple things on my mind. I have actually been someone who, if you look back, past couple of meetings, have been very interested in looking at Memorial Hall and its potential to become an entity in the city that actually raises more money, particularly at the 95% residential, um, rate that we have.
▶ 7:50 Manjula Karamcheti: However, I believe very strongly that it is something that needs to be done thoughtfully, strategically, and as a community, meaning the city works together with the community to determine the future, and one that is actually able to reach the goals of helping us with our finances. I believe very strongly that doing this right now is actually the worst thing that we could do for a variety of reasons. Um, one, it is a, it is a resource that the community depends on in many ways. I think if you ask folks, regardless of the financial situation that we're in, there are a lot of school entities and community entities that use Memorial Hall. It is an affordable rate, and to get rid of it just leaves it empty
▶ 8:46 Manjula Karamcheti: and doing nothing for our community. And I just, I don't think that is the right thing at all for us right now. Um, I was just there a few weeks ago for the, for the pops with high school students. We had, like our artists use that space. I just think it's very shortsighted to get rid of the one entity that oversees that space. That is an important part of our community. And again, I have been someone who is championed looking at Memorial Hall and how it could be closer to a Valier theater closer to other entities. And we actually have $95,000 to do that. So again, it seems very shortsighted to me to do this now as opposed to keep it going. Learn with experts on how to use this resource to the benefit our community to actually help us get out
▶ 9:42 Maya Jamaleddine: of our financial situation. Thank You. Thank you. Uh, councilor Jamal. Thank You. Um, thank you Councilor Ka. Sheri, I wouldn't have said it better than, um, you. Um, I wanted to thank you for all the services that you've been providing to the community, and especially at the Memorial Hall. I wanted to thank your team. I do think that this, I was saving my, um, comments for later, but since we have a motion on, uh, before us, so I would like to actually mention that I think this is very premature, uh, decision to make, to close, uh, uh, the building. As for now, we have a great opportunity with the $95,000 to actually, um, I'm, I'm a strategic planner, so to have that opportunity to strategically plan of how to best use
▶ 10:34 Maya Jamaleddine: that building and that's this great resource is, um, uh, we don't wanna miss that opportunity. Um, uh, I see a lot of communities, uh, in a neighborhood are looking for this kind of buildings and resource. Um, they actually, we, I know that a couple of, uh, other communities, they come and, um, uh, celebrate their events and hold their events at, uh, Memorial Hall, um, and actually attending couple, um, in the next couple of weeks. So, um, just to summarize my thoughts, I think the revenue that we are having In addition to the support and the resources that we provide them for the community and beyond, it's a loss for us to close that building. I do also think that this 95 grand that we are grateful, uh,
▶ 11:25 Maya Jamaleddine: to be able to secure is, um, it, it's good to take the chance and see what we, what would hold for the Memorial Hall so that we can see if actually it would improve and bring more revenue for the city. So thank you so much, and I would definitely support this budget. Thank you. Thank you. Um, vice chair, Jamal, councilor, FANUC Chiro, then mayor of Vandiver, and then Stuart, thank you For the first time. Um, thank you for being here. And I, it pains me to vote against this budget. Um, it, I do not take it lightly. My decision, I thought about it over and over again because, you know, growing up here, and I've performed at Memorial Hall. I mean, we've worked together for years. Uh, the talent show
▶ 12:13 Cal Finocchiaro: and various other, um, sporting events that have been there, banquets. Um, it's my favorite building in the city. I just, every time I'd think about the budget and how we're spending money to keep the building open, I thought of, you know, Mr. Murphy, who just lost his job at the middle school and we're having Principal Merrill cover both buildings. I've thought about the teachers that we've laid out, and it just, I'm looking at this and this is not, you know, I'm trying to remove the emotion from it and looking at it from numbers and just saying, you know, and I, I know I've talked to you about this and, and like I said, this is a very difficult situation for me. And this is where we find ourselves as city counselors.
▶ 12:56 Cal Finocchiaro: We sign up for this job, but I can't approve a bottom line. And, and I've said this before when I, I, I feel like we're, we are, we're asking the community to vote on a very expensive override in the fall, and we're giving up so much right now. Um, you know, the schools are obviously one thing, but in various areas in the city. And, um, this is not a perfect situation. Um, I wish there was something else we could do, but, um, it's just, I wanted to explain to you that, uh, this, I did not take my decision lightly, so, and I do wanna say, you're excellent at your job. You run that place perfectly, and I appreciate all the years. I think you've been there 17 years, you said. Um, so again, I, I'm sorry,
▶ 13:45 Kimberly Vandiver: but I feel like I had to give you my explanation, but I just, um, like I said, I'm just looking at numbers at this point, and that's how I made my decision. Thank you. Thank you. Council Vandiver. Uh, thank you. Uh, uh, I wanted to ask a question. Uh, you mentioned the increase in rates, the study that was done, and, uh, upcoming change to the rate structure. Um, do you have an expectation for the amount of increased revenue for the next fiscal year compared to the prior year based on that rate change? Yes. Um, we do with the rate, if everybody books that has booked for this year, um, the increase in revenue would be around 40, 50,000 more, closer to $50,000. Okay. Thank you. I only have that one question at this time. Thank you. Thank you.
▶ 14:36 Robb Stewart: Um, counsel Stewart. Thank you, Mr. Chair. Thank you Mr. And miss, uh, for being here. Um, so I look at the numbers closely. I drive everyone up the wall here probably. Um, but it's, it's a loss leader, right? It's, we're a hundred thousand dollars, uh, behind and, um, but we're not $215,000 behind. And so what I've heard so far this evening is that, you know, 120 4K plus the additional seven K, so you're gonna be at about, um, 1 31. So that leaves one 17 left. So you're about one 17 behind. Um, if you look at 259 events and you say, well, we're only gonna have 216 events, that's about 83%. You do the multiple, you're gonna get about 88 K, but then you add another maybe 5K, so you're talking about 92, 93 K,
▶ 15:38 Robb Stewart: and if you add the additional rate increase, you're looking of 40 to $50,000. You're looking at about 140, so you're about 70 short, uh, versus 117 short. So I'd be interested in hearing what the, uh, this $95,000 grant investment. And my understanding, and please correct me if I'm wrong, my understanding is they would help try to understand, uh, how we can narrow that gap of $70,000. Is that accurate? Yes. Uh, and what we could do, what are the different scenarios for the building, right. The best use and the management of Memorial Hall, the, that's the goal. The best use, what's The best use, and the management of Memorial Hall and various options From a financial perspective. Mm-hmm. Right. Okay. So, Mr.
▶ 16:31 Robb Stewart: Chair, um, what I would say is, um, I, I, I would agree with the reduction. I do not agree at all to reduce to zero. I think we need to keep it as a functioning building. Um, I think there's, uh, tremendous value, um, not just from a nostalgic perspective, but from a functional perspective. A lot of this community relies on this building for a number of different things, um, both adults as well as children. And I think it would be, uh, irresponsible of us to take that away when, for two things. One, there is a reduction and we could potentially further reduce, but there's also a, a plan to figure out what's gonna be done with this building. And I'd rather see us run at a lower loss or make an adjustment versus taking a more draconian act
▶ 17:31 of closing it down completely. Thank you, Mr. Chair. Thank you. Um, I have Councilor Williams for the first time, and then is there any Councilor Williams and President Elli? And then I have councilor, uh, Ramal Council Machete and Council Hamilton for the second time. Okay. Thank you. Um, Okay. Got everyone. The, The, uh, the revenue that comes into Memorial Hall, is it consistent in its pace, or is there a busy season? No, when you sign the contract, you have to pay a 50% non-refundable deposit. So when they sign the contract, they get it. So it's sort of spread out. Okay. Then when, eight weeks before your event, you must pay it in full. Okay. So there's really, is there a, is there a particularly slow time of year at Memorial Hall?
▶ 18:26 Ryan Williams: Yes, January is very slow. Um, August is very slow. That's about It. Do you have any contracts currently in between origination and execution of the event, for lack of a better word? Have people, have people booked the hall, but they haven't had the event yet? Yes. Okay. For fiscal year 25 or 26 For the calendar year to that remains. So we would be talking mostly about fiscal year 26, Fiscal year 25. I have all of my, their contracts, once I sign 'em, they come contracts. I've mailed out rental applications to all of the events for fiscal, most of them for fiscal year 26. I've only had a return of, well, the deadline is July 1st. That's when I asked for the contracts to come back, and I have only had two return so
▶ 19:13 Ryan Williams: Far. Okay. Um, But the con the rental applications have been mailed out to the people that have requested dates. Okay. Thank you. So, I'm gonna opine for a minute here, as many of us have done, um, tonight. I, I think it's a fair through the chair. It is a fair point of discussion. That's what we're here for, to ask, is this worth it for all of this, the whole budget? So I appreciate, um, although a bold move, I appreciate counselors, uh, raising this question and allowing us to have a robust discussion on it. It's a discussion I'm prepared to have. Like Councillor Stewart said, I've, I have thought about the numbers, and one thing that jumped out at me right away was the fact that if you reduce the budget to zero,
▶ 19:54 Ryan Williams: you've effectively cut something like $50,000 of budgeted expenses for utilities and heat and ongoing maintenance, excuse me, things that might come back to Vita. Um, you know, certainly we would need the building to be heated. We would need the electricity to be left on, and those costs would have to enter the budget at some other point. And we are in an unfortunate, um, moment where our budget is, is extremely, extremely tight. And I don't think that that $50,000 lives right now anywhere else in the budget. That's number one. Number two, I do tend to agree that, um, since we're really only talking about a, like a $75,000 or so deficit in this, and it's, you know, kind of a quasi-public private building,
▶ 20:36 Ryan Williams: that it's a good idea for us to pause to see what this report or analysis comes up with, um, before we make any, any big moves. I will say that I'm not at the point right now where I'm ready to make cuts. I think I've demonstrated that with other votes we've had where other counselors have had appetites for cuts. I don't have an appetite for further cuts from the mayor's already low budget. Um, but if we don't pass an override in November, if there are people who are talking out of both sides of their mouth and are not going to help us get the revenue that we need to push this city forward, then we're gonna be in a different position in 2026. But today, where I sit right now, um, I'm not ready, uh,
▶ 21:20 Leila Migliorelli: certainly to reduce this budget to zero, which is the motion on the floor. Thank you President Meley early. Thank you, Mr. Chair. And thank you Ms. Picket Broder for being here. Um, I guess I am sort of questioning the zero cut here, because as I understand it, we cut this budget. Um, it's not like we're saving the schools with it. Um, I know this is not your forte and you know, I know that CFO Golden is here, but, um, it's a little sort of, uh, performative to cut a budget, um, for with no plan. Um, we can't add it. We can't bring back teachers, we cannot bring back principals. Um, so just kind of gives me pause, um, as to why we would be doing this. It wouldn't necessarily save the city anything at this point in time.
▶ 22:10 Leila Migliorelli: I mean, we've gone through seven weeks of budget hearings and have had nothing cut from any budget. Um, we've cut trees and we've cut the inauguration we have left in our salaries, which total 55,000. I, you know, it's kind of questionable whether we need that. So I, I'm just, I'm definitely not supportive of zeroing out the budget, particularly as I think Councillor Stewart pointed out. You know, we have a plan, um, to study the revenue, um, to kind of go through that process and find out what is the future of Memorial Hall. It's a municipal building that brings not only revenue, um, but it has that un like incalculable public good that needs to be looked at. So, do we have to, as a community decide whether
▶ 22:54 Leila Migliorelli: that public good is worth supporting at a loss, or whether it's time to move on and, um, explore other options, which would be selling the building, having someone, you know, a professional company management manage it, but there's no one around this horseshoe that's qualified to make that decision. I'm sorry. I know we like to think that, I know we campaign on these things, um, but it's not, I don't know that anyone here has had experience in running a venue. Um, I think, I think that the other piece of this is public lack of public conversation and input. Um, I would not be comfortable, and I'm kind of fairly shocked that we would go and try to motion to cut a building without any public input
▶ 23:37 Leila Migliorelli: when we have, um, you know, decided to use, uh, the BB school for the police station. We've had extensive public discussions on this extensive, painful discussions about that building. And again, I think it's a little bit, um, a little ambitious of us to go and cut a building that, what did you say, Kathy? There is, um, 200 and something events planned for next year. Right now it's 203 dates this year we have 259 And let's some of that, you know, fiscal year 26 starts July one. Correct. And I know that there's camps there this summer. Yes. In July. Yeah. So again, I don't really see how this is helping the community at all, or how it's a difficult decision, um, to deal with it, particularly since we have a plan as how,
▶ 24:27 Leila Migliorelli: uh, how to deal with it. Um, I will just also point out, um, that if we don't, if so, if we close the building, we still have to, we would have to cancel all of those contracts and those events with zero plans. And I, I would invite through the chair if my council colleagues have plans on how to hold these events, what their communication strategy would be for canceling all of them, um, or if they have other ideas in mind. So, um, I'll leave it for there right now. Thank you. Thank you. Okay. That's everyone for the first time. Second time I have Councilor Romanul, and then Council Ham, uh, sorry, councilor McNaught, and then Councilor Hamilton. Thank you, Mr. Chair. Um, I, I did have one more question
▶ 25:11 Devin Romanul: as, as I heard my colleagues talking. Has there ever been any analysis or thought into what the economic impact is for the 48,000 people who come into our city who ostensibly might stick around to shop, walk around, visit our various beautiful, you know, shops, restaurants, parks, things like that? Has there any been any thought or, or competitive analysis on, on what that looks like? No, I don't think there's been any analysis of it, but I do think that, uh, Kathy's done a pretty spectacular job of advertising our local businesses during those events. Um, I think at this point you have a QR code that, uh, folks can, uh, access in order to visit, you know, the restaurants and other businesses in our
▶ 26:00 community when they hear from an event. So that's been, I think, um, of a tremendous benefit to the business community. I'm also a member of the Chamber of Commerce and, um, you know, many of our members appreciate what she's done to promote the business community here. Yeah. I also get a lot of phone calls from people asking me about what the attendance is in some of events, especially in directly downtown, the pizza places. And Sep will call me, Shaw's will call me for June for recital month. Like, how many people do you think of attending? Because they know it directly affects them. And the QR code is on our, is directly set up so that you can go to our website and I list all the businesses, Mount Wells,
▶ 26:35 not just downtown, and I list them by category. If it's, you're looking for a grocery store, if you're list looking for a florist so that they can just scan it and say, this is where I can go to get what I need. Yeah. Also, in between for, for example, recitals, when they drop off rehearsals, the parents are here for two hours, where can they go? They can scan the code 'cause it's right as they enter the building and they can know what's in the neighbor the area, so they can promote, they can, we can promote our local businesses. Yeah. I, I was, I was just thinking about the, you know, secondary and tertiary impacts of, of closing an institution that it's difficult to make that kind of decision in a vacuum.
▶ 27:12 Devin Romanul: Makes me think of, I was at the, um, grocery store today and my 5-year-old pulled out the bottom grapefruit. Um, unbeknownst to him what was holding it up on the, the pyramid of other grapefruits. And I, I just, I think about the proposal and what that might mean. I, I, I take very seriously, I, I through the chair appreciate my colleagues, um, creativity and suggestions and, and I think that I, I really, uh, wanted to give it some serious thought. And, um, I take the concern seriously, the fiscal pinch inflationary challenges are hitting everywhere, and it's making us pit teacher salaries against events. It's making us pit paving roads against, you know, a DPW director against a, you know, a firefighter.
▶ 27:56 Devin Romanul: And it really, um, tho those are very difficult conversations to have, to figure out what is the public utility, and that's not in dollars and cents. What is the public utility of having each of these positions? And that, that is a very complicated question. It's a very different question for each of us. Those who are parents, those who aren't, those who live in particular neighborhoods, those who don't. And I think that, um, we, we have to feed the soul too. I think that that is a part of the character of our community. Um, you know, I, I pulled up a quote that John Adams said, I must study politics and war. So my sons have the liberty to study mathematics and philosophy. My sons ought to study mathematics
▶ 28:33 Devin Romanul: and philosophy, geography, natural history, and naval architecture. So my others, their children can study painting, poetry and music. And I, I think that this is a part of the character of our community, and I don't so b blindly dismiss it. And I, I'm not saying that blithely is the right word for my colleagues. I just, I feel strongly that, uh, the practical implication of it is, is pretty profound. I think, um, as some other colleagues noted, if we go to zero, you know, things can break. I don't know if anyone has not heated their house when they go away on vacation, but it really stinks when you come home to, uh, water in the basement. Um, and, and then there's the economic implications as well.
▶ 29:13 Devin Romanul: So I, I think I would be a no on, on zeroing out. Um, and I also, uh, just two more things. I'm sorry. Uh, if, if we, I feel like it is shortsighted to say, zeroing it out because we are on the precipice of a study that will give us a roadmap forward. And I think that we do take a couple of steps backwards on that, where we to zero it out and lose out, uh, I think a more, um, expeditious opportunity to take advantage of the beautiful asset that we have. We have on there a couple times a month for various events. And, uh, and then finally it's not as if, you know, I think I also think play the tape to the end. Well then this becomes free cash. And while free cash is valuable, it does not effectively solve the litany of, uh,
▶ 29:55 Manjula Karamcheti: fiscal challenges that we have that I think would be, um, better addressed in other methods. So I really appreciate the, the candor and the, uh, thoughts. But I would be, uh, a pretty strong No, thank you. Thank You. Council Chetty. Um, just a couple things in listening to my colleagues, um, from the original proposal, two positions that were mentioned on the city side, which were the city engineer and facilities. I think something that I'm thinking about is those two positions are vacant. And I appreciate fiscally when any city or school department has to make hard decisions about positions. The humane thing is to not fill positions. I I think we are in a different situation when we're thinking about cutting positions that are filled.
▶ 30:49 Manjula Karamcheti: And I know we needed to do that with the school department, but that's situation in terms of the deficit is very different. Um, and our superintendent had a strategy for why he thought the positions that he was removing made sense for kids and for the community. I am not seeing that here, and the dots are just not adding up for me in terms of why this cut right now, given the, the pieces of this puzzle. There is a grant, there is a human in a position running this building that serves our community in a wide variety of ways. And so, I guess one of the things I wanted to ask you, and I don't mean to put you on the spot, but like, I think you said like 293 events, like, those are the school, like 2 59, 2 50, sorry.
▶ 31:47 Manjula Karamcheti: Um, but like, I would love for you to just share as many as you can think of in terms of what those events are. Not expecting you to do the two 50, but I think it is relevant to the conversation. We have what we lose in being able to host people who are paying to use the building. So that part is not lost on me. Well, right off the bat, Meryll Symphony Orchestra, it's the oldest continuing orchestra in the building. They've been there for over a hundred years. The Merose Youth Ballet comes in and does rehearsals all through October and November. And for performances, which they had to increase to six performances last year, 'cause they sold out within a a week of selling tickets. We have just today, I, we have a group,
▶ 32:29 it's called the Parish Air. It's an Indian concert series throughout the country. And they're coming to us. I have recitals and rehearsals the entire month of June. I have the Knights of Columbus fundraiser. I'm trying to go through my list of events. I have, um, uh, in July. July was a dead month for me. No one was, um, booking it. So I, um, connected with the rec department. They needed a location for the Lego Robotics Lego Program, which started out two weeks, and it grew so fast. We now do four weeks, which fills the hall. 'cause the most expensive room in a hotel is the empty one. I have, um, auditions for the Mel Youth Ballet in August, then starting in September, I have the food in October.
▶ 33:12 The food drive has their host, their fundraiser there. We have the Mouse High School Pops concert. The kid, the high school, um, band and orchestra had their concert there. We just had a three day event with the polymer. I had, I just had an event, it's called Kids' Curtain Call. It's a theater group. It's actually out of Lynn Winthrop and one other town. I don't know. They have three locations. They just had a three day event there. They had two days of rehearsals and one day of, um, performances all day where people from around the city around, not within the city, but outside the city, came and went downtown for businesses. Um, I, I'm, that's pretty good. I think that's a wonderful cross section of who is served,
▶ 33:58 Manjula Karamcheti: um, in, in the building and what it's providing. So I appreciate that, and I recognize it's a snapshot. Well, I, I know I've got Bo Boston boxing and Like my tag, which The adults of this community Love those events. I get more calls when those are coming and they come for, they, I've now booked them for four times a year. Each of those organizations. And I will just say again, as a community member, but as a city counselor, it's probably Memorial hall's, probably the place that I have spent the most time in other than these Chambers and Melrose High School when it comes to my kids' events and community events. And, and that does matter, um, from Lego Camp to the marching band banquet and everything in between.
▶ 34:44 Ward Hamilton: So it's a cherished space and I appreciate it. Thank you. Council Hamilton. Thank you. To reiterate, uh, my first comment, there is no doubt what the value is to Memorial Hall and our community. No doubt whatsoever. Our position on the city council is very limited. We can approve a budget before us, we can reject it, or we can make a motion to cut it in some way. And I studied on that and I worked with the city solicitor. I don't feel qualified to go into this budget and find a way to make it make sense to reduce it. I see that it's $61,000 to keep the lights and the heat on and to honor our contractual obligations. What I'm concerned about is the narrative in this community. And if anyone around this horseshoe thinks that
▶ 35:46 Ward Hamilton: they're gonna go and they're gonna sell to the community, I don't mean the people that are gonna automatically vote yes. And we forget the people who are gonna vote no, but the people in the middle who we need to sell and override to, which I have been very vocally supportive of. If you think that you can convince them that it makes sense to keep a building open, that is a financial loser. And I don't like that word. It's unfortunate, but that's what it is. And if you think that you can simultaneously sell that to the community, well, it's a wonderful place and great things happen. And I know it costs a lot. Good luck if this stays in the budget as it is in full. I'm, I'm open to amending this number.
▶ 36:33 Ward Hamilton: If this stays in his full next week. I'm a no vote on this budget. And I don't know where I stand on the override because I'm about making difficult decisions. Things like Memorial Hall, the library, the senior center, they are wonderful things in this community. But If you think, if anyone thinks that we can just continue to operate, like nothing bad is happening here, look the other way. Just give us more money. It's not gonna fly and it's gonna be a disaster in November, and we need an override to pass or we're gonna be in big trouble. So I'm open to what, uh, folks here think. If someone is open to amending this budget, then I'm certainly work willing to work with, you know, my, my colleagues.
▶ 37:19 Cal Finocchiaro: But as it is, as it stands right here, I can't get behind this and not, 'cause I don't want to. I love Melrose. I love good times in mellows. I love events and, and, and great things that we can do in our community, but it's gonna be a very hard sell, um, to our voters. Thank you. Thank you. Council Fanook Yarro, then Council Vandiver and Council Chetty, then Councilor, president Elli. Thanks. Um, councilor, uh, Hamilton said some of the things I wanted to say, but I'll just reiterate. Um, you know, mayor passes the budget down to us and we are elected to look at it and make decisions on it. And we are limited with what we can do. And zeroing of this budget is not a perfect situation. Um, I would also be open to amending it if that's possible.
▶ 38:10 Cal Finocchiaro: But, um, we are talking about dire budget, dire budgets with everything that has been going on with this, um, with the current budget and, you know, police, fire, DBW, the schools, those are like essentials. And I'm not saying I, I love Memorial Hall and it is an essential part of our community, but it's not essential when we're talking about like a, a very dire budget. And that, that's just, that's how I see it going forward. And I, it's not that I never wanna see Memorial Hall operating, it's just right now, um, that was kind of the, the thought process of my decision. It's, you know, um, so anyways, I, um, like I would be open to, like I said, possibly amending the budget, zeroing it is not ideal,
▶ 39:05 Kimberly Vandiver: but, um, like, like counselor will, um, Hamilton said, we are limited to what we can do, um, with the mayor's budget. So, um, that's it. Thank you Councilor Vandiver. Thank you Chair. Uh, a few comments, uh, one minor point, but you mentioned the QR code. That's very, that's fairly neat and those can be set up as well to track the traffic that originates from them. Might be something to consider in the future to further show the utilization. Um, I wanted to clarify my understanding of the way that our role works for anybody who's listing in the public is that, you know, others have alluded to it, but I just want to be very clear that if we use zeroed out this budget, this money would not go to free cash.
▶ 39:52 Kimberly Vandiver: It would not go to another budget. It would not go to next year. It would in fact remove, it would lower entire spending cap. So it would essentially be a mini anti override. We would be saying our ability to raise funds in the future is two point half percent of a lower number every single year from now forward. Um, so I just, I don't think it makes any sense. I, I think it's frustrating that our, in our role as counselors that we can't, you know, move money around more than we can. But, but really we can say yes or we can say less money that that's our role as counselors. Um, so I, I just don't think that makes any sense from that perspective. Um, I wanted to, through the chair also comment on,
▶ 40:34 Kimberly Vandiver: I think a great point that may have, um, also, um, I'd like to spell it more that Councilor Stewart made. Um, he mentioned that this is a loss leader. Um, a loss leader for anyone who doesn't know is a technical term that's a, is something that you lose money on that brings people in the door so that they spend more money throughout your entire business. And so what I believe I would assume he means by that is that, um, you know, that this work and, and money that's spent, even if at a loss, is having a much greater impact financially as well as, um, in other ways within the community and is worth having. Um, I believe the classic example of a loss leader is hot dogs at Costco. And, uh, the CEO has threatened everyone on the staff
▶ 41:20 Kimberly Vandiver: that if you ever raise them above a dollar, whatever it is, you know, you can never do that because that's what gets people in the door. They spend lots of other money at Costco. Um, so I just wanted to highlight that. Um, and then looking at, I, I know we're talking at the moment about the relu, the, um, motion to zero it out, but I just, I mean, I'm looking at, there are eight lines in this budget and they, none of them seem particularly fluffy. I don't know where you would even cut anything. Electricity, gas, heat, elevator maintenance. We've heard that's required. Building repair and maintenance, professional services, maybe, I dunno what the 16 k there goes, I know I've asked last year about
▶ 41:57 Kimberly Vandiver: supplies, that's cleaning supplies. I mean, I cut the cleaning supplies. I, I don't know, um, marketing supplies, um, $800, I assume that's like paper and ink and then salary and wages and I, I mean, maybe you could run with one less custodian, it'd be a little dirtier. I'm not sure. I'm not sure where you would, there's not a lot, you know, it's not like you could take some money out and then I, I just don't understand what would happen there. And as the others have mentioned, I mean, I assume that if we were to cancel all these contracts, if we were even going down that road, which I don't think makes any sense. I mean, I assume we would be hit with all sorts of fees in the contract on our end for canceling everything.
▶ 42:35 Mark Garipay: So I, I just, I understand the sentiment, I understand that it's tough. I understand that, you know, it might be difficult for the community to understand, but I think it's very defensible to spend this money. So thank you. Thank you. Um, for the council, we have a, a hearing at 7 45. We need to, um, we need to gavel into, we do have two counselors that are speaking for the second time. We do have another third counsel are speaking for the third time. Our rules do say they could speak twice to a, something at hand. So, um, I think I've been pretty lenient on, on the discussion. Um, so we have 15 minutes to the two counselors that are speaking for the second time, do they think we can do this fairly, fairly quickly?
▶ 43:25 Leila Migliorelli: And then, okay, president Elli and then Council Stewart for the second time. Thank you, Mr. Chair. Um, I, I'm a little, I think troubled by a conversation about how this impacts quote, selling and override. I mean, that's not our job as a council. That's, that's a campaign objective. Um, I support an override. I also support thoughtful planning. Um, I'm not worried about, you know, what people say in the community. My job is to make hard decisions. And the hard decision is that, you know, we've supported the mayor's $2.6 million in cuts. That's based on her knowledge and her team's knowledge on where they think the cuts make sense. Um, and I'm imagining that the Memorial Hall budget wasn't touched
▶ 44:17 Leila Migliorelli: because of this planning grant in place, and that it is true that if we end up not ha not passing the override, passing the override, whatever, regardless, that that planning process will then prove a point as to what will happen next. And then it will be cut then. So again, I I, I don't, I really don't understand the logic in this. And, um, and I, you know, if we're gonna again, cut something, cut our salaries $55,000, I don't, I don't really see the point. And, um, you know, are we integral to be being paid? Um, no. Just, you know, there is a cut in this budget. I Cut the s Right, exactly. Yes. And I cut, there's cuts. Yes. Thank you. So 2.6 million. Um, and, and it, this saves nothing. So it's, it's demonstrative to whomever
▶ 45:12 Robb Stewart: people are talking to. Um, and it's not actually having an impact, um, on the lives of residents. It's, it's just not so, uh, I'm really, I'm just not comfortable. I'm not comfortable in cutting it. Um, I, and, and I don't really see the, the point of bringing up quote, selling and override in this council chamber. Thank you, Mr. Chair. Council Stewart. Thank You, Mr. Chair. Um, just briefly and, uh, to the chair, uh, president mc kind of said what I was thinking, uh, in terms of, um, the mayor and her team has spent a lot of time, uh, inordinate amount of time going through and, and justifying, uh, all aspects of this budget. And, and I don't think that it was overlooked that this, um, would be, uh,
▶ 46:12 Robb Stewart: a cost to the community. But, uh, what I'm assuming is that the value that the, that the cost brings supersedes the impact of the budget. And for that reason, um, I think it's justified. Uh, I, again, I'm a numbers guide and you know this Mr. Chair. I, I do have concerns about the gap. Um, uh, my, I would not support, uh, a reduction to zero. Um, what I would do, I, I, I would support this budget, but with the expectation from the administration to solve the problem going forward. And I know they have money to help do that, but I would expect them to not come to us the following year with the same problem. I would expect that this problem is gonna be solved this year, and figuring out how Memorial Hall can be used,
▶ 52:22 Okay. That will be recommended to the full council. And I'll entertain a motion to adjourn. So moved. Second. Have a motion to adjourn by Councilor Williams. Seconded by Council Stewart on discussion. All in favor? Aye. Opposed? Thank you. Just do it. Thanks for not raising water rates. Everybody Recording. Stop because I, perfect timing. Okay. We are back in session, appropriations budget hearings with Memorial Hall. With us. Do we have Ms. Ter? Uh, Mr. Izzy, thank you. Um, rounding of questions here we have, um, counselor Williams, and then Counselor Ache. Yeah. Thank you. Sorry, sorry. Flow Us. Yeah, no problem. I'm going, I'm going for the second time here. Um, on the topic of managing this budget
▶ 53:58 Ryan Williams: and the discussion, the, the, the, the sentiment that we need to demonstrate that we are making cuts to, um, show fiscal responsibility before we are asking people to spend more. Um, I, you know, with the, with the, with the trees, which was the other cut that we made, um, I felt the same way, which is that these numbers are fairly small. They don't seem small to the public. We don't operate in the space of 5,000, 10,000, $15,000. We operate in the space of a hundred million dollars, and we are looking at costs that are escalating, um, far greater than a hundred thousand dollars or even $200,000. And if you want an example, look at the pension obligations. The pension obligations are gonna go up from seven
▶ 54:45 Ryan Williams: and a half million dollars this year to $13.5 million by 2038. And they're gonna go up to about $10 million by I think, 2030. That's $3 million in the next five years of just pension obligations that we have to fund. So, you know, I, I, I, again, I appreciate the discussion and I'm looking for opportunities to, um, to make the budget more efficient. I'm looking for opportunities to improve services for our residents, and I'm open to the conversation in that context. But the truth is, we just need more revenue to support these costs, and we need it in the next year and in future years in order to be able to keep this city financially solvent. Thank you. Thank You. Councilor Choice. Thank you, chair. I know this is my third time,
▶ 55:30 Manjula Karamcheti: so I will keep it brief. Um, I respect the proposal in that I know our constituents are asking us to be fiscally responsible. I think this, there's a budget before us that already includes cuts in it. And when I, I really try to talk to as many constituents as possible, um, to help inform my actions and my decisions. And I will say that I have yet to talk to a constituent who wants to shut down Memorial Hall. I have talked to many, many, many constituents who want a strategic plan for how Memorial Hall can make us more money and help us build our capacity on the commercial side. And so, like with that in mind, I feel like the right thing to do is to vote for this budget and use the grant money, um, to figure out a way
▶ 56:39 Manjula Karamcheti: to make Memorial Hall much more profitable. And with that, I, uh, chair, not chair, uh, president me has said it a couple times. If we really are concerned about the deficit of Memorial Hall, we should cut our salaries. I think that just makes much more sense. It comes to about 55,000, and I don't remember the exact number. You said Counselor Stewart, but it was around there. So let's just do that. That's it. Thank you. That budget's already been approved, so we can't can't it too late for that. Um, As a promise for next time, then. Thank you. Um, um, okay. So we have a motion on the floor to reduce the Memorial Hall budget, $215,937 down to zero. Um, that was on discussion. Do you have another?
▶ 57:37 Cal Finocchiaro: Yeah, thank you. Um, sorry, I know this is the third time I'm speaking, um, through the chair. I just wanna, um, reference your comment about speaking to res residents. I have heard from many residents actually, uh, about specifically the Memorial Hall budget, and they're willing to have it close for a little while, if that's, if that's the case. And, and, and again, it's not a perfect situation, it's just these are the things, these are the things I'm hearing from people in our community. Um, so we Talking to different people I know. Okay. No, no. Back and forth. Um, sorry. So we have a motion on the floor on discussion. We already had Council Jamal Ledine. Thank you. Um, and I'll try to make it very, uh, short and brief.
▶ 58:28 Maya Jamaleddine: I wanted to invite my colleagues to think about, um, you know, when we did, uh, reduce the, the trees, um, money was, you know, was something a difficult conversation. It was a diff uh, very difficult decision that we made. But however, now we are talking, we cannot compare apples to, to whatever, oranges or whatever. We're talking about a, um, department that is bringing some revenue. And we have a, a great opportunity that's going to actually advise us how to bring more, uh, revenue and how to best use this building. So for us as, um, you know, in addition to presenting the override, we're also promising our constituents that we are thinking about different ways to bring more revenue so we don't have to, uh, consistently,
▶ 59:29 Maya Jamaleddine: um, you know, rely on overrides or, uh, other stuff. So for, I think this is very, um, fiscally responsible and, and, um, to, to actually support this budget and to wait to see what the strategic planning is going to do for us is, was what is it going to, um, advise us to do? And hopefully next year we will be, we will review it based on this, uh, um, recommendation and see if this is something that we, we would continue do supporting or not. Um, I do appreciate all the discussion that's happening. Uh, every single counselor brought very important points. I do think this is the, uh, value of this chamber and this, uh, council, but I, you know, stand with my decision that I would support, um, the budget for
▶ 1:00:25 Leila Migliorelli: and keeping the Memorial Hall open. Thank you, president Elli. Uh, just, um, one point of clarification for the, in the charter, uh, just for my colleagues and people watching, it says, the board of trustees of the soldiers and sailors Memorial Building shall have charge and control of the repairs, maintenance and management of the soldiers and sailors memorial building, and any personnel assigned to perform repairs, maintenance, and management of said facility. The trustee shall have full power to use rent or grant, or use a property under the jurisdiction and set the conditions and terms thereof. Such conditions and terms shall be approved by the city solicitor. So just wanna be clear, um, through the chair
▶ 1:01:06 Leila Migliorelli: that if we zero out the building, uh, you know, we don't have, we don't have the authority to, to close it. Um, there still have to be decisions that are made, um, by the board and the administration. So we would essentially just be removing, um, the cost to operate, um, and setting in motion a series of, um, other discussions about how that building, um, will operate. Um, and I would like to, uh, clarify that with, um, Mr. Izzy, um, if that's your understanding of the role of the board of Trustees, It is my understanding. Obviously, I would defer to the city solicitor as to the implication of zeroing out the budget, but that is certainly my understanding. I've read the, read the charter. I understand what our mission is. Okay.
▶ 1:01:55 Thank you. But I, I would also, given the opportunity now, and I, I apologize if I'm talking out of school here. Um, you know, I, I think that we as trustees, I think everyone respects the process that you all have to undergo. And we know that it's a difficult process. Um, none of us feel that it's appropriate to pit one department against another or one employee against another. Um, and we recognize that there are difficult decisions that have to be made. We don't envy you otherwise, we'd run for election, I guess, if we want it to be in your shoes, but we're not. Um, but I do think that one thing that's been lost or maybe not articulated, or maybe I apologize if I didn't hear it, is that, you know,
▶ 1:02:50 the soldiers in Sailors Memorial building is a living memorial dedicated to the men and women that have fought for our freedom. It's not just a revenue stream or a revenue source, it's a cultural, it's a civic center. It's part of the fabric of our community. And so I understand that it might be a lost leader per se, but the reality of the matter is that it symbolizes a lot more than just dollars and cents coming into this community. And I would venture to guess that there are many departments in this city that don't operate at a profit, and yet I haven't seen or heard of their budgets being zeroed out or cut. So with all due respect to the chair, I think we as trustees recognize Kathy's value to that building.
▶ 1:03:50 Ward Hamilton: But more importantly, we recognize that the value of that building to our community, um, and we would hope that you would take that into consideration when voting this budget. 'cause I think it's bare bones and I think it's essential. Thank you. Thank Council Hamilton. Very quickly, um, just to hit on a few things. First of all, to President M's. Point, I guess it sounds like we don't have the ability to close this building, which is great. Um, but we do have the ability to reduce or eliminate the budget. And I believe the Board of Trustees has access to, uh, a fund that I believe is in the neighborhood of a hundred thousand dollars. And, uh, as far as the comments about foregoing our stipend,
▶ 1:04:38 Ward Hamilton: four or $5,000 a year, I would gladly give it up. It's nothing. Okay? I would rather tell people I'm a volunteer than I do this for four or $5,000 a year, whatever the amount is. Um, nobody discounts the value of Memorial Hall. Nobody discounts the value of the sacrifice sacrifices that were made over 150 years ago to preserve this union. It's, in my opinion, second to the revolution. It's the single most, uh, forming event in the history of our nation. And it's important, it's very important. Uh, I don't want to close the building, but I don't want to continue doing the things, doing things the way that we are doing. And our hands are tied on the council. We have very limited options. Thank you, all of you for bearing with me in my comments.
▶ 1:05:33 I know that they don't align with the majority of the council. Thank you. Did you have a comment, Mr. Izzy? Uh, Through the chair. I just wanted to respond to, uh, cons Hamilton, with respect to the Restoration Fund, as you probably know, the Restoration Fund is a fund that, um, is funded, not to be redundant, but, uh, $1 per ticket sold goes toward the Restoration Fund for the maintenance of the building. Uh, the vast majority of the funds, um, as you probably already know, um, there was a, um, a groundswell of support shown to the Memorial Hall, um, by the Friends of Memorial Hall running a fundraiser for the restoration of the GAR room. And in support of that effort, uh, the trustees voted
▶ 1:06:28 to allocate the restoration fund money to also restore the GAR room. So those funds have been allocated from our perspective, are committed. I don't know the proper terminology. Um, so with respect to, um, those funds, they're limited in terms of scope and what we can use them for. We certainly can't pay our executive director. We can't pay, um, the janitorial staff, um, and what we can use those funds for. They've been committed to be used. And that's for the GAR room. Um, and there are funds available for that, both through, uh, the trustees and our vote, but as well as the Friends of Memorial Hall who raise those funds, uh, through the generous donations of, uh, members of our community.
▶ 1:07:13 Mark Garipay: Thank you. Um, so we have a motion on the floor, um, to reduce Memorial budget, $215,937. We've already done discussion. Um, all in favor of reducing the budget. Say yay. Aye. All opposed? No. All opposed. So that amendment or motion is Chair. Do you mind if we do vote? I just confusing Councilor Jamal Ledine? No. Councilor Occhio? No. Councilor Hamilton? I think, yes. Yeah. We're we're redoing the vote that we just did. Yes. Right. I just wanted to understand if they were voting the same way as each other, because I thought they were on opposite sides of that vote. We have a motion. Let's start over. We have a motion on the floor to reduce the budget down to zero. So we're reducing it down to zero
▶ 1:08:20 Mark Garipay: A yes vote would be in favor. A no vote would be not in favor. Could you mind starting the roll over? Thank you. Sorry about that. Councilor Jamine? No. Councilor Occhio? Yes. Counselor Hamilton? Yes. Counselor Caram Chetty? No. Councilor Romanul? No. Councilor Stewart? No. Councilor Vandiver? Uh, no. No. Okay. Councilor Williams? No. Coun President. Elli? No. Chair. Garey? No. So that, uh, that motion does not pass. We have the Memorial Hall budget in front of us. Um, motion. Motion to recommend move to the bottom line. Second, We have a motion to recommend the bottom line of Memorial Hall Department 6 93, made by President Mili, seconded by, uh, councilor Carmen Sheets. Can I ask one question? In, in, in your, uh,
▶ 1:09:25 Mark Garipay: just curious, um, in your, um, information you left with us, you just said, due to the city engineer position going unfilled, the GAR room restoration project has been put on hold. Is that funded through your, to be fund free cash for that? Or was that funded through, um, the fund, the restoration. The Restoration Fund and the Friends of Memorial Hall. Okay. Thank you. That was my only question. Anyone else have discussion on moving the bottom line of Memorial Hall? Okay. All in favor? Aye. Opposed? Nay. So the bottom line will be, um, recommended or is moved? Sorry. Alright. Thank you very much. Thank you. Thank you very All Thank you much for your time. I appreciate it. Next up, we have two 11 police.
▶ 1:10:13 We have Chief Alia with us, and I believe, uh, Kim Upton. Good evening. Chief Floor is yours. Uh, Sure. Uh, thank you for having us tonight. Uh, as the chair said, I am chief Kevin Fowler with me as my office manager, uh, Ms. Kim Upton. Uh, we are here tonight to present our FY 26 budget. I know, uh, you all have, uh, received a copy of it. Our our budgets are relatively straightforward. It's about 95% ish, uh, salaries and wages, uh, with the other 5%, um, contractual supplies, materials and so forth. I think the highlight, uh, well that's a, that's a poor term. Probably the low light of our budget is we, we lost positions, um, through attrition. Uh, as one of the councilors stated earlier.
▶ 1:11:19 Fortunately, we didn't have to lay anybody off. We didn't have to. Um, but it's unfortunate. We, uh, one of our positions was, uh, took the, the early buyout incentive from the city and one of our younger officers elected to resign for a, um, to pursue a job in another department. So those are the positions that weren't filled for FY 26 and two offices at face value may not sound a lot, but for a department our size and what we're strategically trying to do moving forward, it is, I mean, it's roughly five or 6% of our patrol force. Um, we're gonna get the job done as we we do. Um, but in order to make our budget work, um, that's the unfortunate reality is that we are losing positions. The other sort of ancillary effect of that is,
▶ 1:12:08 as you all know, it's very difficult to fill positions and it's, it's very unusual to see public safety being cut. I will say that to be transparent, agencies are trying to find offices having difficult time finding qualified offices where we're actually eliminating offices, uh, not happy with it, but will will get by. Um, having said that, the rest of our contractual and supplies and material line items are, are in front of you. I believe, uh, we pretty much level funded, reduced, or eliminated every, uh, line in that item to make this budget work, with the exception of one, uh, dues and membership, which, uh, you know, um, vendors, prices go up. Really nothing you can do there. So we did our best to make this work.
▶ 1:12:52 Robb Stewart: Um, so I would welcome any questions if you have any, uh, qualifying questions on the specific line items. Thank you, chief. Any questions for the chief council? Stewart? Thank you, Mr. Chair. And thank you Chief Elliot, uh, for being here, uh, as well as Ms. Ton. Appreciate it. Um, the question I have is, uh, with the two eliminated resources, um, your, you had said in your packet that you're expecting that overtime is gonna go up, right? Um, and we were level funded on overtime from 25 to 26 on the budget, right at 4 57 or 4 58. Um, what is your best guesstimate of how much additional, uh, cost that's gonna incur for the added overtime that's gonna be required given that you're down two, IT counsel, if you, if you remember last year too,
▶ 1:14:01 I think we had the same, uh, sort of conversation when it came to overtime for training, uh, mandatory training, which is upwards of 60 hours that we're mandated to do every year. And that line item is again, gonna be a challenge, which is, uh, congruent. It's, it's, it's, we have two different light items. We have regular overtime and OT training overtime. It's going to be a challenge. I'm not gonna say it's not, I don't have a guess guesstimate, best guesstimate of what we would go over, but I anticipate we will. Um, and the reasons being not only losing two positions, the current staff that we do have, right? We have 34 patrol offices well budgeted for next year, or 33, I forget where we were, but we lost two.
▶ 1:14:44 We have a, we have a, It says 35 35, So we have a substantial, we have a certain amount of offices that are military, um, obligated, right. Um, doing, serving our country. So those offices, if you really want to talk about relief factors and how much they actually count towards personnel, you know, they're gone once a month for training, all 5, 6, 7 of them. I wish I had the exact number of them. And then had a, a lieutenant that was gone for 16 months last year on active duty. So if you look at the bottom line and you say, we have 35 patrol officer, or a total of 49 50 last year, total sworn, I, I would argue that we really don't because we, we lose, uh, offices to, um, obligations, military obligations.
▶ 1:15:32 We lose offices for your sick time, your injury time, other time. That just happens, right? And I actually just had this conversation with my patrol commander, my command staff today, how good we've been with injuries. And I don't mean to jinx us. It's not talking like a, Hey, you got a no-hitter going. Right? Uh, but we've had some very serious incidents, and I don't want to get into them, uh, but I will a little bit. In the last month with our offices have disarmed three armed individuals, one with a butcher knife, one with a machete, and one with a box cutter. None of the suspects were injured. A couple of our offices were injured, but they didn't lose time. One was cut in the hand pretty good. Could have been worse.
▶ 1:16:13 Right. And I actually said that to my patrol commander. I said, you know, I've seen offices, I've seen agencies where people jump at the gun when they get a little roughed up, right? And they want to go out injured and they want to collect one 11 f our guys and our women aren't doing that. And we're able to get by, I'm kind of talking in circles here, but your, your overtime question, it could be a lot worse if we didn't have the culture and we didn't have the personnel on our job that show up to work and don't try to take advantage of things that they could do. And, and it's difficult for me to try to maintain that culture when we get cuts like this. And how do I do that? How do I solve that?
▶ 1:16:47 Robb Stewart: Is just try to lead by example. And it, and it starts from the top and it starts from the bottom. It, it just meets in the middle. And I'm very proud of our guys. So I don't know what that number's gonna be, but I can assure you it's gonna be very difficult to meet. Sure. Well, just given the history and looking at the data, um, you know, given that you are about 80 5K over the, the budgeted amount, I would expect that it'll be somewhat similar this coming year and, uh, that we should expect that you'd be coming back before us so that we you could close that difference. Um, Yeah, my concern counselor is, is last year we, you know, we operated on paper, we had a full budget, a full staff on paper,
▶ 1:17:33 but we were down six offices for probably 10 months of that fiscal year. Because they're in training, they're in the academy for six months and there's three months of failed training. They're not actually in a spot to fill a vacancy until they're done with that nine months of training this July 1st, we'll have a full staff according to this budget if approved. But we will lose more offices. That's just a given. I, I had several offices retire or leave last year that we didn't think they were going to. That's just the nature of the game. And I asked the mayor and I asked Kerry, you know, where, where is this going to stop? Um, with the cuts, I can operate this fiscal year, but what happens if and when, more likely when an officer
▶ 1:18:17 or two or three leaves this fiscal year that I'm not counting on, they're not 65, they don't have to retire, but people will leave, I hope. And I anticipate because those positions are already budgeted, that we will have the authority to fill those, um, civil services change. The way we hire has changed good and bad. It's now increased competition as in the private sector. Even though we're different, we're becoming a job of the haves and have nots. And if we don't provide the best, um, sort of everything, right? Money, uh, culture, equipment, um, we risk losing them. And, and I, I hope we don't. Thank you. Um, well, I just as a comment, I, I think that, uh, as a council, Mr. Chair, I think we made the right decision to support Polly
▶ 1:19:08 Robb Stewart: and her, um, hiring, uh, budget. So we do have, we did support that, uh, chief and, um, what, just one other question regarding when someone goes on active duty or has a military, do we still pay them the full-time salary while they're on active duty? Or Kim is a little bit more, um, versed on it? We do up to a certain point, I believe. Yeah. There's a certain number of weeks that we pay them. Uh, they're full and then there is a period of time where we pay them a difference between their military and, and the city, um, salary. And then after that, there's no more payment and, you know, until they're back for, I don't know, a certain number of days and then everything starts all over again.
▶ 1:19:57 Okay, good. 'cause I was concerned that we'd be paying someone that's absent then someone another one time and a half. So almost like two and a half times no. Okay. Okay. Good. Yeah, no, good, good. But that does happen, like, um, you know, on the active duty and National Guard ones that go away for weekend, uh, trainings, that's, that's exactly what happens. They're still getting their full salary and we have to backfill their overtime for Sure. Yeah. Two and a half, right? Yep. So Yeah. Weekend warriors, all they get paid full, full Pay. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Alright. Thank you Mr. Chair. Thank you both. Appreciate It. Any other questions? Council Vanderberg. Thank you Chair. Um, I, I had the same question about the National
▶ 1:20:35 Kimberly Vandiver: Guard pay, that type of thing. So thank you for asking that already. Um, wanted to commend you on what you mentioned about having the, the multiple, um, instances of disarming someone without injury to those, those people, into having the culture that supported that. Um, and I also wanted to, um, mention for anyone watching that in the memo, there are some additional accomplishments that I, that I think were, um, you know, worth calling out here. And, and I'm glad that we, we have this variety of things here. I I dunno if you wanna speak to any of those or, or anything like that, but, um, there are a number of good things in here as well. Thank you. I, I forget what I wrote, Kim. I'm sorry.
▶ 1:21:16 Kimberly Vandiver: I'm not trying to have you indulge me and tell me what I wrote, but I apologize. I Well, I would be happy to call it a few of them. So, um, you have listed a number of community engagement events here. I know, um, I've talked to people, you know, speak constituents who are very excited about the bike bus and your participation in that as well as you've listed, you know, half a dozen other things here. Um, I think the training on a variety of topics, including sexual assault investigators, um, evidence management, the diversity, um, within the staff increase increasing, having an Arabic speaking officer now, um, Haitian Creole Asian, uh, Asian American, African-American heritage, and really getting, uh, more of a variety
▶ 1:22:00 Kimberly Vandiver: of faces in there too, for the community that's done engaging with them, I think is really impactful. Um, and, uh, you know, I think those are, those are a few that jump out to me, but I really appreciate that section in the work that you're doing. So thank you Councilor Williams. And then Council Romano. Uh, yeah. Well, I was actually gonna make a motion to move the bottom line on two 11. Thank you for all your good work. Second, We have a motion to move the bottom line on two 11, made by Council Williams, seconded by Council Stewart on discussion. Council Romano. Uh, thank you, Mr. Chair. Uh, thank you chief, uh, appreciate, um, the information for all that you do in your department. I, I just wanted to, um,
▶ 1:22:43 Devin Romanul: if you could elaborate a little bit on some of the other cuts, just so the folks in our, uh, in this body and our community can understand the impact of the increased fiscal tightening. So it's not just the two officers, and you did a great job at outlining the, the court time, the generator, in case it breaks being, you know, we just hope it doesn't, and then we have to come back for one time appropriations from here or the DBW for other things for, um, you know, legal materials to understand the evolution of the law and things like, uh, you know, uh, uh, going to testify in court. I thought that number was a little bit jarring to see that percentage drop. Um, but I'm wondering if you can talk about the impact on,
▶ 1:23:21 Devin Romanul: on the, you know, the work that you do, the service, uh, that you're providing and, and ways that our community can, um, try to quantify, um, how we nip and tuck and, and how that impacts, um, you know, public safety across the board. Sure. Thank you. Uh, I mean, some of, some of the, you know, you mentioned like the, the generator, right? Uh, not, not an exorbitant amount of money, but obviously if the generator feels, we may have to come back, you know, that was a little cushion if it, it's broke. Um, the radio system, uh, was reduced, uh, from 29,000 to 20,000. Um, we'll, we'll still get by. We were fortunate last year we got an amark from the state and some free cash to buy some radios last year
▶ 1:24:03 to help us absorb that cost. But normally that would go to buying, you know, updated portable radios or radios for the cruisers, or, and there's always MDOs, there's always something that goes wrong with that radio system, which we would need. So hopefully we'll be okay with that. But certainly, um, not as much as we would normally need. But, uh, last year helped us out a little bit. This current fiscal year, I should say. Uh, some of the books, uh, law updates I usually buy, um, uh, not me, but the city, uh, buys all our, uh, command staff, uh, patrol supervisor and detectives, all the updated legal books and so forth that they won't get those this year. But we can look online. Luckily I teach legal update
▶ 1:24:41 and service for the people, so I try to disseminate electronically more of the updates. But it's always nice to have books. Um, uniform line item was reduced a little bit, but that was reflective of the offices that were lost. And that's a contractual thing. Um, some of our training fees, um, um, we, we cut that, um, that, that's gonna hurt a little bit, right? Because training is, is big to me. And those are, those are costs for, uh, tuition classes. Uh, anything that, uh, goes to, um, sending office to schools that aren't mandated by the state. Uh, extra training, like the sexual assault training, things that crime scene, investigative training, we're gonna hurt a little bit there. And, and training to me is invaluable,
▶ 1:25:21 but, um, it, it, it is what it is to say, right? I mean, that was just an area that I, I we, we, we elected to cut a little bit. It helped a little bit, uh, in a weird way that we're not hiring the two positions because those, that training, uh, line item was used to help to pay for tuition for the academy, uh, and some of those fees. So we don't really need them for the two at this time. Um, which is a, which is another issue because, and I don't know where it landed in the state. If we do hire again and we send 'em to the academy, the, uh, state was looking at doubling the tuition fees from 3,200 to 6,400, which in which is an unaided unfunded mandate on cities and municipalities and towns, mass chiefs, Middlesex chiefs,
▶ 1:26:02 all the memberships that I belong to came out strongly against that, because that affects the bottom line here. Um, but yes, I mean, all the, all the things that we did cut will certainly have an impact on the community. Um, but our offices, you know, we're, we're doing a good job. We're still gonna get the job done, but there will be an impact. Some of the, you know, someone had asked me yesterday, and I don't mean to go off topic a little bit, but there's no national night out this year, you know, that. I was very proud of that last two years, what we did. Um, that takes a lot of manpower, takes a lot of money, takes a lot of personnel. Um, and that's a, that's tough to cut that. I will make it up though. We'll, we'll have, I,
▶ 1:26:43 Devin Romanul: I told the officers we'll have more smaller events, uh, because community engagement, reaching out to the kids, the community, having those nice fun meet and greet things is very, very big to me for recruitment and just community relations. So we might not see the giant national head out that we had the last two years, but we'll do something. Well, thank you so much for, uh, your work here. And I hope that folks for whom public safety is an important part of their, you know, conception of, um, what city government does. I, I hope that they're tuning in. Um, 'cause this is really important stuff. So thank you for that. Thank you. Thank you. So we have a motion to move the bottom line of the police.
▶ 1:27:24 Um, uh, we're already on discussion. All in favor? Aye. Opposed? That bottom line will be moved. Next step chief, we here, here for, uh, revolving account, I believe 2 6, 6 5 false alarm revolving account. Um, we continue to have a, a false alarm fund that I don't really collect too much on. I, I will, if someone is a repeat offender over and over and they don't, you know, do what they need to do to get their alarms, I will send them a bill. But your regular home, you know, the rule is you get two free, uh, calls and then on the third one we charge you, you know, $50. The fourth one, it's a hundred, you know, and it goes, but again, at this point in time, um, the, the residential ones I haven't billed.
▶ 1:28:24 And, and I know I could, and maybe I should to get some more, you know, funding, but I usually, uh, just go for the businesses. So, and they're very good about paying, you know, once in a while, you know, the, the typical, uh, pizza shop will hit it over and over and over again. But they, they usually then get their alarms fixed. When you say, if you don't mind, when you say, um, residence, if it's in a building of six or more apartments, that's considered a commercial building, or How do we, if they even, yeah, if they even have a, a resident or, or a, uh, condominium or apartment complex, whatever. There aren't too many alarms that have been registered in there. Usually it's single family homes usually,
▶ 1:29:15 but there are a couple of, um, you know, 2, 2, 3, 4 family that have, one will have it and one will not. So then it's hard to determine whose alarm went off. So I'm also very careful because I don't want to go sending out a bill to somebody when it could have been, you know, the next door neighbor or something like that, because I apologize for, that's my ignorance. I'm thinking of a fire alarm. I'm sorry. Anyways, council steward. Yeah. Thank, thank You, Mr. Chair. And that, that was my question. This security alarm? Yeah. Oh, I'm sorry. Yes. They're all security alarms. Security alarms, yes. All right. All security alarms. Okay. And so these are the ones that are tied into the police department?
▶ 1:29:58 They're not tied in. They, the alarm goes off like SimpliSafe, uh, what's the other? A DT? Um, But then they call you? Yes. Okay. Well, the, the alarm will go off. It will get notified. But if simply, if they, if SimpliSafe, if they call SimpliSafe first and shut it off, we don't even get called at all. So, um, it's only if the alarm then gets further triggered and they, and they do, they need a police officer to go and check to see and clear the area and make sure that everything's fine. It, you know, it, it is what it is, but, So when they find the cat and saw the cat, okay. Uhhuh? Yeah. Yeah. All. Yeah. Thank you, Mr. Chair. I'll make a motion to re uh, to move. Second, we move this one to the bottom line. Yes.
▶ 1:30:47 Mark Garipay: I'll make a motion. Move this to move this to the bottom line. A motion to move, uh, 2 6, 6 5. False alarm revolving account. Um, move the bottom line by Council Stewart, seconded by council fro in discussion. All in favor? Aye. Opposed? That bottom line is moved. If, um, if, if, if you would indulge me, if we could have, maybe take an order outta order so we can let the chief go. Yeah, Mr. It's up for, uh, Mr. Chair. I'll make a motion to take, uh, order. Which one is it? First 1, 1, 2, 6, 5, 1, 1, 2, 6, 5, 1. Out of order? Second. We have a motion to take 1, 2, 6, 5, 1 out of order made by Council Stewart and who seconded that President Elli on discussion. All in favor? Opposed? That order is now in front of us.
▶ 1:31:42 Mark Garipay: 1, 2, 6, 5, 1, and appropriation from free cash 0 1 3 2 4 0 0 1 and the amount of 90,000 to the police department. Number two 11 for the purchase of a new cruiser. I know the chief, um, probably a month ago now, sent out a memo answering I think a lot of the questions I'm hoping, um, but f floor is yours, Uh, Mr. Chair. Thank you. Yes. It was actually May 7th, uh, that we had sent out, um, the memo to try, try to hopefully clarify some of the questions that had come up during the full council meeting, which was after the first appropriation appropriations committee meeting in which I presented, uh, the need slash request for $90,000 for an unmarked administrative, uh, cruiser. Um, I don't know if you want me to revisit the whole, uh,
▶ 1:32:30 reasons why, but I, I'm certainly here now in front of you. Again, if any questions from the first meeting in which I was here, or any questions from my memo that may have not been clarified, I know I spoke to several of you, or at least one, uh, personally, uh, since that meeting, but I'm, I'm here again, uh, respectfully requesting that amount. Anyone have any questions? Counsel, Could I just ask, you said the email was sent on the 7th of May mm-hmm. Through the council. Who was it sent from Through the chair? May 8th from, um, Tangie Uni. Got it. So the memo was dated May, May 7th. Yes. That I have that. Thank you. I just wanted to pull it up during the meeting. Thank you. Uh, president Elli,
▶ 1:33:14 I, I have no further questions. I thought the the memo was helpful. Um, and I would, uh, make a motion to recommend Second, second. Second, we have a motion to recommend id. 1, 2, 6, 5 1 made by President Elli, seconded by Counsel Stewart on discussion. Ms. Um, council Vanderberg, Thank you. I just wanted to say I appreciated, we did have a follow-up discussion. I appreciated you answering my questions, so thank you. Thank you. At this time, I would support the motion. Uh, Madam Clerk, can you please call the roll? Yes. Councilor Jamine? Yes. Counselor fro? Yes. Counselor Hamilton? Yes. Counselor Kara Chetty? Yes. Counselor? Yes. Counselor Stewart? Yes. Counselor Vandiver? Yes. Counselor Williams? Yes. President Elli? Yes.
▶ 1:34:06 Chair Garipay? Yes. That order will be re recommended again to the full council. Okay. Thank, Thank you. Enjoy your night. Next up we have Department 1 35 Auditor. We have ms. Um, okay. We have Kerry Golden, the CFO with us today. Thank you. Hi. Um, so thank you for having me tonight, um, to talk on both budget 1 35 and 9 42, uh, 9 42 as the stabilization fund. Um, as the CFOI am responsible for overseeing all financial aspects of the city. Um, and that includes the broader departments of assessing and the Treasurer collector, as well as it, um, as far as the auditor's budget, which we're here to talk about tonight, um, the auditor's budget mostly focuses on compliance, um, compliance with Mass General law compliance
▶ 1:35:08 with collective bargaining agreements, um, meeting state and federal deadlines. And we're able to do that with, um, the four staff members within the department. So it's myself, the CFO City auditor, uh, and my role is to develop the financial plans and oversee the broader financial functions of the city, um, as well as monitor revenues and expense transactions, um, and provide information for everyone to make informed decisions. Uh, we have the assistant city auditor, and, um, her role is to process all the journal entries, monitor the budget, set up new funds for earmarks, grants, bonds, et cetera. We have accounts payable, um, and that person is responsible for processing both the weekly warrants for the city, as well
▶ 1:35:58 as the biweekly warrants for the school department via both check and wire transfers, and responsible for the annual 10 99 compliance for reporting to the IRS. And then we have our payroll manager who is responsible for processing the weekly payroll, um, and reviewing the biweekly payroll, which is our teacher's payroll. And, um, managing the setup and auditing payroll to make sure it's in compliance with collective bargaining agreements, um, as well as update all of the benefit, um, deductions. Um, so the staffing is the largest part of the department. Um, the other portion of our department is really compliance with year end deliverables and, uh, financial management. Um, so we have our annual audit,
▶ 1:36:46 and that is performed by cbis, which, um, acquired our, so we started off with Powers and Sullivan. They were qui acquired in January of 2024 by Markum. And then Markum was acquired by CBI in August of 2024. So they are currently our outside auditors. Uh, we use Clifton Larson annually to come in and help with our DLS Yearend reporting. We use Stone Consultants, uh, to calculate our opep liability, um, every other year. And then in the off year, we do a roll forward. Um, so these line items are going up for, um, both the change in the contract, um, and just recognizing increased cost, um, as far as the 9 42 budget. Um, so that is just a hundred thousand dollars to both the ope, um, trust fund
▶ 1:37:41 Mark Garipay: and $50,000 to the City Stabilization fund. So I provided the balances and, um, why we try to contribute to those annually. Answer any questions. If you guys have anything, Any questions from the council? Council, I was gonna make a motion to recommend to move to bottom line. Second, We have a motion to, uh, to move, move the bottom line on Department 1 35. Auditor made by Vice Chair Jamal, seconded by Council Fanucchi. One discussion. All in favor? Aye. Aye. Opposed? That bottom line is moved. Um, we held Council Stewart, Mr. Chair, I'll make a motion to move on. Number 9 42, the bottom line. Second, We have a motion to move 9 42 stabilization fund OPED funds, uh, made by Council Stewart. Seconded by council, uh, vice Chair Jamal, on discussion.
▶ 1:38:42 All in favor? A opposed? That is moved. Um, 2 31 Ambulance Enterprise Fund. Yes, I'll speak on behalf of that. Yours. Um, so this is just a housekeeping item. Um, as we know, chief White made the decision to privatize the ambulance services to Armstrong effective June one. Um, so the Ambu Ambulance Fund is no longer necessary. It was set up in 2012 to collect the fees, um, associated with ambulance transports. And now since we have a private company doing that, um, they will receive all the revenue, um, for that. And so ultimately at the end of the year, uh, come June 30th, whatever assets, liabilities, um, balance in the enterprise fund, that will all close out to the city's general fund at the fi at the end
▶ 1:39:37 Mark Garipay: of the fiscal year and be certified as part of the fiscal 25 free cash. So do we need to move the bottom line of what's in there? Is there anything in there? No. Nope. Nothing in there? Nope. It's just, uh, I think the request is to revoke the original order that was established back in 2012. Oh, is that approved To give the agenda tonight? To revoke the Fund? Oh, that's a, that's under the orders. I'm sorry, I missed that. Um, okay, thank you on that. Next up we have 2 91 Emergency management. That's 2 91. No One, I don't see that on the agenda. Yeah. Um, it was added, um, this week. It wasn't on the original. Oh, I see. It's kind of a, a housekeeping 'cause we, um, more or less eliminated the budget,
▶ 1:40:34 Jen Grigoraitis: but the mayor is here to speak to it. I see. Right? Yep. Thank You. Yes, thank you. So, um, briefly, as I believe you're all aware, the emergency management department is still gonna procedurally be a department because we need to show, since it was a department last year, but the, um, there's no longer separate staff, Alan Alpert, who had been in that role since 2018 when it became a separate department, um, left in May to begin his retirement, though he did not retire from the city, but to begin his life as a retiree. Um, and so as one of our budget reductions, we have taken that to be a stipended role. Um, we are required by state law to have someone to serve as the emergency management director.
▶ 1:41:13 Jen Grigoraitis: Prior to this becoming its own department in, uh, 2018, it had been held by Ruth Clay when she was the health director. And then prior to that by former Fire Chief Chief Leary. Um, based on what most other communities do, we've asked Chief White to take on this role with the stipend. There's a lot of overlap in the work of the fire department and emergency management. They work with a lot of similar state and federal agencies, and he has graciously agreed to do that. So the only amount remaining in the budget is the stipend for, um, chief White and for a small amount for the administrative cost to support, um, the work of his administrative assistant related to emergency management. Okay. Any questions?
▶ 1:41:57 Maya Jamaleddine: Mr. Chair? I'll make a motion to, oh, there's a question in my, Did you have a Question? I do have actually a question. Um, thank you Madam Mayor, would you mind, um, just sharing with us, um, since we're, you know, now we're in process of talking about the impact of every cut that we are having, what would be the impact of eliminating this, um, whole position? So we obviously it's a reduction in the amount of staff that we'll have to dedicate to this. I think the most noticeable thing, um, for the public is that, um, this position has been going after a lot of grant funding, particularly money that's set aside through FEMA and mema, specifically for supporting emergency management departments.
▶ 1:42:37 Jen Grigoraitis: Um, so that will need to be picked up by Chief White as he is able. Um, so I anticipate we'll probably be seeking fewer grant funds to support work. Um, also attending a lot of regional trainings, which kept us both engaged with our, you know, peer communities and connected to them. And again, I know the chief will do his best to do that, um, as his time permits, but they'll just be less of a presence from Melrose in that professional world. And are we anticipating any overtime due to this cut? No, we are not at this time, no. Okay. Thank you. Welcome. Okay. Anyone else? Council Stewart, I'll make a motion to move to the bottom line. Second, We have a motion to move the bottom line of 2 91.
▶ 1:43:27 Mark Garipay: Emergency Management made by Council Stewart, seconded by, uh, vice GM on discussion. All in favor? Aye. Opposed? That bottom line. Moved. Next step, we have appropriation request for 2025. ID 1, 2 7, 3 7 and appropriation in the amount of $150,000 from free cash to the Affordable Housing trust number 8 2 7 0. Do You wanna get started? Sure. Hello, I'm Lori Massa, the planning director, um, for the city. So, um, I'm here with the mayor to request $150,000, um, to be allocated of free cash to the Affordable Housing Trust fund. The fund was established in 2020, um, and the board got going in earnest, um, thanks to the mayor in January of, of, um, this year. And we received the help of the Massachusetts Housing Partnership Technical
▶ 1:44:27 Assistance Grant. Um, to get going, um, with this board, there are five members, um, on the board of trustees and the planning department staffs the board. We, uh, established draft mission, uh, draft mission and goals, um, and we're working on an action plan and application materials, um, for the trust. We'll have community engagement in the fall before finalizing the plan. Um, as the trustees plan for possibilities of, um, their work, having more funding is critical to making an impact in the community. Um, Melrose doesn't have the Community Preservation Act, which is a surcharge on the tax levy against, um, real property. And so this is a form of funding that, um, most affordable housing trusts in the Commonwealth
▶ 1:45:17 use as their source of funding. Um, so our trust doesn't have that. Um, so the funds that we do have are from, um, payment in lieu of, um, affordable housing or payments for fractional units, um, of affordable housing that are required in our zoning ordinance. And there was a $75,000 allocation, um, to the fund for, uh, free cash in 2021. So the total right now is, um, approximately $600,000. Um, so trust funds are an important tool for addressing our local needs for affordable housing. And, um, our board members are eager to finalize action plan, um, and get to work putting the funds to good use. Council of RO then Council Hamilton's. Sorry, council Jamal. Um, I'm not familiar. So what would, what would the trust fund,
▶ 1:46:10 what would you use those, that money for? Like, can you gimme an actual example? Sure. So, um, the, they, the, um, the trust fund draft goals right now are in three categories. Um, so funding development and educational and outreach. So within the development, um, goal, there are two strategies where the bulk of the, the money would be used. Um, so one is explore programs that would support, um, home ownership or housing access for low and moderate income households. So that could include things like, um, loans for down payment assistance, uh, for qualified applicants or, um, loans for rehab of units. Um, and then the, another strategy is develop processing criteria for allocating trust, um, funds.
▶ 1:47:03 So this would be, um, giving out, um, grants or loans for developing, uh, affordable housing or rehabbing, um, to create deed restricted affordable units. Um, so an applicant, um, that, you know, is, um, working right now in this would, would benefit from funds would be like the affordable housing trust, the affordable housing, um, corporation, they, you know, purchase, um, units in the community and, and hold them as affordable units. So, uh, um, you know, nonprofit like that. Um, or, you know, there, there are other potential applicants for the funds. Um, so the, um, you know, the trust is working, um, on the action plan and kind of, um, finalizing what they're doing, but knowing that we don't have kind of a steady stream
▶ 1:47:56 of income, um, you know, creates a situation where we're, you know, one of the, the strategies around is around funding and being creative with finding other sources of funding, but there really isn't, you know, a lot with, um, well a lot coming in. So when there's an opportunity to, to add to the funds, um, we should take it. 'cause it's obviously a critical issue, um, here and, and regionally, So just, just to clarify this, so the, the funds go directly into a residence, uh, helps them to, uh, pay for housing, Right? So the, the majority of the development kind of goal would be around creating deed restricted affordable units. So it's units that would stay affordable in perpetuity. Um, so, but there were, there is potential that the,
▶ 1:48:41 this trust could be, um, funding programs through loans or grants where, you know, somebody that's qualified their income qualified, um, to be able to, you know, afford a down payment for a, a house or, um, you know, there's work that needs to be done in a unit and they just don't have that extra money, um, to put towards, um, rehab. Then there's, there's potential that these funds could be used for those, that kind of work. Okay. And, and is there a dumber that you'd have to, uh, get to, to be able to actually, you know, grant people money to for living There? There isn't a, a magic number. I mean, it's, the fund's gonna work with what they have, but at the same time, you know, things are very expensive.
▶ 1:49:27 So, um, having some impact of, you know, if it was like a down payment, um, assistance, you think about how much it costs for, you know, a unit and how much, how much money you need for, um, down payment and assistance. So this, this group is, if they don't have a lot of money, they're gonna be infected with education and advocacy and things like that. But in terms of the actual funding of affordable housing, it's gonna be very limited. Thank You. Council Hamilton. Thank You. Thank you for being here. And affordable housing is something I've been involved in, in this community for over 10 years, and I recognize its importance and I thank you for what you're doing. I, I see the value in that work.
▶ 1:50:12 Ward Hamilton: Earlier today, um, in response to my request, you indicated that, um, the trust fund has taken in about $614,000 to date. Have you dispersed or spent any of those funds yet? No. Okay. And before we appropriate another $150,000, um, do you have a plan in place for how you're going to disperse funds and how that will work? So that, that's what the board is actively working on. Um, right now it's just, you know, it's, even though $600,000 sounds like a lot, it's, if you think of, you know, how much money you'd be granting an applicant, it, it doesn't go very far. So, um, kind of knowing, planning for what kinds of work that the, the trust would be doing, it would be helpful to have that money.
▶ 1:51:07 Ward Hamilton: Yeah, I appreciate your comment that the communities that have such trusts also have the Community Preservation Act, and I understand that affordable housing is one of the four allowable uses and, um, we can all dream that we'll have CPA here in Melrose someday, maybe. Um, but at this time, and it's nothing to do with the work that your office does in or the importance of affordable housing, but to sort of, um, build on comments that I made earlier this evening on an unrelated matter, I'm very concerned about optics on spending, and I believe that we need an override to pass in this community, and I'm committed to that, and I will not waver from that position. But since taking such a strong position maybe a week ago,
▶ 1:52:04 Ward Hamilton: um, I now have a heightened focus on items that come before us. And I absolutely recognize the value in this, and I do not wish to diminish that in any way. But right now, I feel, um, that it, it might be inappropriate given that you have over $600,000 if, um, your folks on your board were to develop that plan further and come back, uh, I would be willing to entertain that. But right now, unfortunately I can't support this. But thank you. Anything else? Oh, I'm sorry. Council Jamal, you, I'm sorry. I radiate. It's okay. Sorry. Thank you. Um, do you, I know this is relatively new. The trust fund is relatively very new and, you know, probably we are still not seeing a lot of, uh, fruitful results yet,
▶ 1:53:02 Jen Grigoraitis: but I do believe that down the road this is a great resource for our community. Do you have any, um, data of what we were able to accomplish until this moment in terms of supporting like direct support? Do you want me? Sure. So I mean, I think to provide a bigger context, um, so that obviously as some of you know, 'cause you were here, this, there wasn't an ability to spend this money until the trust was created by this council in 2021, and then there was never anyone appointed to it until this year, thanks to all of you. So the, there was no ability to do any of this and to spend the money. Um, and the $600,000 is what's been accumulated in, you know, totality over the course of there being payments and loose.
▶ 1:53:47 Jen Grigoraitis: Since most developments in Melrose are relatively small, you're seeing, you know, 50,000 here, 20,000 there, that gets deposited. Um, since the board was fully staffed, they have met monthly, if not actually more often than that. Um, and are working to develop the str strategic plan, um, to Councilor Hamilton question about, you know, what is, how are they gonna disperse the money? There's already an interested party looking to engage with the trust for support. However, the trust felt that it made sense to actually develop a plan and a process before they started cutting checks. Um, so that's been the work with, um, the MA with mass housing to kind of come up with the goals and objectives and a, a process so
▶ 1:54:27 Jen Grigoraitis: that there can be a formal application process to consider that application. So I think there's a little bit of building the plane while we're flying it. Um, but also, um, it's something I think like Councillor Hamilton I'm very passionate about. I think as we talk about affordability in this community, I know we talk about taxes that only applies to people who already own a home here. Um, this is about trying to remove some of those barriers to entry to be a homeowner in Melrose, which we know is becoming harder and harder to do. Um, and also Secretary Augustus at a recent meeting of Metro mayors, um, acknowledged that, and he's the Secretary of Housing and livable communities for the state,
▶ 1:55:04 Jen Grigoraitis: that housing development costs have gone up 30% since 2021. So also a recognition that with each year, um, you know, as we continue to, the money has sat, it, its, its value is less because of those costs going up. So, um, obviously our cycle of free cash is such that we have this window of time now in order to, um, you know, possibly move this money if that's the will of the council. But I do think the trust is working very aggressively, partly knowing that there's an applicant looking to access funding, but to kind of come up with a plan and a procedure that they feel like they can stand up for future use. Yeah, and I, I have no doubt I'm, I truly like a hundred percent agree with you. Uh, and that makes total sense.
▶ 1:55:47 Jen Grigoraitis: Um, my question is, you know, how did we, uh, identify 150, um, like what this specific number, This, candidly, this was a request of the trust to consider free cash. It's obviously only been done one time before. This is the last free cash order that is before this body. We've tried to, you know, disperse free cash and or an order of urgency. I'll phrase it that way. So I think as you know, you started off with almost a million dollars to close the budget gap on the fire department, and then we've sort of tried to go both as we address immediate needs and then to also think about the midterm and the long term. Because, and I, you all have had a very challenging seven weeks. I know you're at the end here.
▶ 1:56:28 Um, we're in a really challenging budget moment. Hopefully that changes. It may not, um, for future years, but I, we also have to be thinking on multiple tracks about immediate, midterm and long term. So we tried to take that approach with the free cash that we had available. Yeah. And if we are going to talk about, uh, results and outcome, when are we able to measure those, um, uh, you know, like impact? So we will do that as, you know, as the trust, um, does their work and can wraps up the, their action plan and, um, you know, the, the trust meets monthly. And so we, you know, are, um, going to certainly kind of share the news of, of the work of the trust, um, and we can, you know, But we don't have any timeline yet. It's the,
▶ 1:57:21 Maya Jamaleddine: They're working very aggressively at the moment. So Yeah. But I Have no doubt it's, Um, you know, and we have a potential, uh, applicant. So, um, it's, um, yeah, there, they're, I don't have an answer for exactly, you know Yeah. With what the timeline would Be, but, and I'm sorry, I I didn't mean to put you on the spot. I, you know, as much as, um, I'm, I'm a hundred percent in support and I will definitely support this, uh, order, um, me being passionate about this specific initiative, I would love to be always informed and know, you know, those measurements, how, what are the successes that we, uh, were able to achieve and how us as uh, members can we support also. Um, so, but thank you so much for the work
▶ 1:58:09 that you guys are doing. This is amazing. Okay. Thank you President Vera. Sorry. Thank You, Mr. Chair. Um, the mayor kind of already answered some of my questions, but just the point of clarification as I was, as I joined the mayor when she was on the council in accepting, um, the order to establish the affordable housing trust, my recollection is that this is kind almost like a, you know, it's a fund we're building into because there is no steady stream of income. The source of income for this fund in part comes through free cash. When you build up a considerable amount, it sounds like the affordable trust trustees are coming up with a way to disperse it that way that it will be dispersed, will be dispersed to individuals
▶ 1:58:53 who need assistance, home buying assistance or whatever it is. But it, it is a, it is a resident support fund, um, not for projects and design or whatnot. It's, it's not how do we build more affordable housing. It is how, how we can, uh, grant out that money to individuals. Is that cor that's the line of thinking that the, the trustees are going on, correct. The yes There, if the fund had more money, there is, you know, in other communities, if there's projects that's, you know, um, a hundred percent affordable and, you know, those kinds of projects often use like, you know, 10 different sources of funding to make it work. And so in those cases, sometimes a, a local affordable housing, um, trust will, you know,
▶ 1:59:40 close the gap of a certain amount of money to, um, have those kinds of projects, um, happen. So right now in Melrose, we, um, we don't have a developer that's, you know, actively working, um, to be able to, you know, think that that's gonna happen anytime soon. But it could, and you know, that it is a potential, um, you know, uh, mechanism to, to use some of the funds, but it's not that the inclusionary housing will just go away. Those units are required through our zoning. And that's gonna continue, um, as it is. So it's not funding for profit developers. It would, you know, potentially, um, if there's a nonprofit all, you know, affordable, um, housing development that comes along, um, funding could be allocated for that.
▶ 2:00:30 Leila Migliorelli: Okay. So non nonprofits and or residents who are in need of, so this is sort of a direct support fund. So in terms of trying to, um, you know, measure outcomes and or think about the impact on the community, this is one of those, um, opportunities in which the residents get to feel the direct impact because they are, you know, in essence at some point, once this is, uh, you know, has more funding and a plan to disperse it and, um, the ability to apply for these funds to help support them. And this ask here is to continue to grow that fund. So I'm supportive of it as I was of supportive of the trust creation as I think it's important to, uh, directly provide assistance to residents in Melrose
▶ 2:01:13 Ryan Williams: who are looking to, um, you know, to increase affordability. So thank you. Thank you. Council Williams. Yeah, thank you. Um, so I, I started my career fundraising for affordable housing, um, projects, the big pro, the big projects that you're talking about, and also the services that go into them. Um, and so I am excited to see movement into the, into the trust fund. Um, I wanted to, to, uh, through the chair, just a point of clarification. This is kind of a personal, um, um, statement, I suppose, but the, there is a funding source for these kinds of trusts, and it's the Community Preservation Act. And I wish we had at Melrose, and I would love to work on that campaign. I've said that many, many times over the years.
▶ 2:01:59 Ryan Williams: Um, but we always seem to have these huge competing financial needs that are in front of us to the point where we can't, um, go to people and ask them for what is a really limited small amount of money that goes onto the property tax bill, where seniors and people with, uh, low and moderate incomes are exempt, and then the state kicks in 30% of the funds. It's like the best amount of money raising we can do in this city, and we just can't find the political will and the air in the room to do it. Um, so that being said, you know, I, I think it's a fantastic policy directive to put money aside for direct, um, payments to people in need. It's, it's demonstrated that this helps people, that it,
▶ 2:02:37 Ryan Williams: it ends up saving more money than it costs for cities to give straight cash payments to people in need. Um, some of the questions that I have around this are what utilization we're getting out of this at the moment, whether this is the right moment for us to be putting $150,000 of free cash into this. So, so first off, um, the, the fact that we don't have an actual plan in place yet is difficult for me. Um, I do trust the members of the, of the housing trust. I trust them. I trust the administration to do the right thing. Um, but what I heard was that we have one applicant and we certainly don't have one applicant for $640,000. Right? We have one applicant for something else. Can you disclose, are you comfortable disclosing the scale
▶ 2:03:17 Ryan Williams: of that application request? Is it a person who's looking for a down payment assistance? Is it a person who's looking for rental assistance? So it's the Melrose Affordable Housing Corporation. And, um, you know, I don't remember the, the request amount. Okay. Um, off the top of my Head, I don't know the exact amount, but it would be bringing multiple units that are currently not affordable into being deed restricted affordable units. Would they be purchasing the units with the funds to make them deed restricted? 'cause that's, I mean, I believe so, but we haven't formally received their application yet. Understood. We told them we wanted to have a processed In place. Yeah. Understood. Yeah.
▶ 2:03:57 Ryan Williams: I, I think this is moving in the, in the right direction. Yep. I think this is really exciting. Um, it would be a huge leap of faith for me to say yes to $150,000 in free cash without having any of that mm-hmm. In front of me right now. And I would sort of, I would be like more, more willing to hold this for 45 days and see if we can get more clarity versus saying no to it. Um, and I'm not a hundred percent sure the logistics of what that does with the year Through the chair. Free cash has to be allocated by June 30th, otherwise it will roll back into, um, to be recertified as free cash again for FY 27. Yeah. Next year. Okay. Which means that potentially, you know, if we don't have flexibility,
▶ 2:04:43 Ryan Williams: how much free cash do we have left after this? If this goes through, I have to look at Carrie, I think it's 416,000, About 400,000 than dollars. One of the recommendations from the division of local services has been to not spend free cash to zero to Yeah, of course. To roll some over. So that's been sort of, our target was about 500,000 to roll over of the amount we were allocated we had this year. Okay. So this is where I am right now. Um, it's hard for me, it's hard for me to vote yes on this. And it's, it's painful to say that because it's something that I really, really deeply support and want to see in the community. So I'm not saying no, I'm sort of undecided. I want to hear more comments from counselors
▶ 2:05:24 Ryan Williams: and hear where other people are at. Um, and I, and I would strongly encourage the trust to come before us with a more detailed plan, um, including what the outcomes of the spending would be, what the application from the corporation looks like, how many units, what the costs will be allocated to. Because when we are talking about fiscal responsibility, um, it, it sounds, it will sound, it will sound to skeptical residents. It will sound difficult to say, we don't really know what they're spending it on, but we sure hope that it goes to a good cause and that it goes to, you know, deed restricted, affordable housing. And I want to know that that's the case and have more confidence saying it. That's it. Thank you. Thank you,
▶ 2:06:05 Kimberly Vandiver: Council ver thank You chair. Uh, thank you for presenting this to us. Um, I, I'm, I'm really happy to see this. I'm glad that this is getting underway. Um, I, I wanted to clarify that. So it sounds like there are a few different ways that the money could be used. The current potential applicant is talking about making deed restricted affordable housing. I just wanted to clarify, because I've heard it a few times people talking about dispersing funds in a way that sounds like maybe it's just giving away the money. But I believe what you've said is that this, the typical way that this would be dispersed is a loan that would then come back into the fund once the person had used it for their down payment
▶ 2:06:47 and been able essentially to participate in the housing process. Right. So Right. There are different mechanisms that, you know, the, the trust can use. Um, they can grant a loan for, um, you know, an extended period of time and it be forgiven in the end or, um, structure it, so it needs to be paid back. Um, and same if it for these residential programs, um, it could be, you know, a, a loan or a grant. Um, so, but the, the board is mindful of needing to, um, you know, be able to sustain this money. So helping, you know, people now and in the future is on their minds when, you know, but it's, it's tough when the funds are so limited and there isn't a steady source of income. Um, so the board was hoping that, you know, this board
▶ 2:07:41 Kimberly Vandiver: with free cash would kind of prioritize this, this need in the community and, um, at least have a, an ability to, to, um, to ask, um, for, for money for the trust. Thank you. And, and I, I think to, you know, things that you all to, to state, um, for the record, I mean, I think this is so important because, you know, to the, to the discussion, the kind of the elephant of the room about what, what will people say here and, you know, see us doing, um, people talk about affordability in Melrose, and, um, you know, this, this is targeted at the people for whom Melrose is not affordable, right. The people who can't put together enough for a down payment or who can't live in the community that they
▶ 2:08:25 Kimberly Vandiver: otherwise do live in or work in, unless they have this affordable housing that to be developed, right. This, this is in, this is the work of helping out the people who can't afford the rest of it. Right. And, and I just, you know, I, I don't have a prepared statement that articulates it really well, but I think I, I think this directly addresses the segment that isn't able to otherwise afford Melrose. And so I, I would love to see this pass and I hope it does. Thank you. Council Stewart. Thank you, Mr. Chair. Um, when I was listening to Constable Williams, Mr. Chair, um, he touched upon a lot of my thoughts. Um, but first, let me let start with just a couple questions, if you don't mind. Um, how many, what, in recent years,
▶ 2:09:22 what affordable housing has been, uh, built or created in? So it's the, the units that are, um, required for every project that has eight or more, uh, residential units, 15% of those units have to be de restricted, affordable housing. And then if you have, um, the five, six, or seven units you can, uh, pay into the, the trust, um, payment in lieu, you can provide the unit or, or pay, um, into this trust. So, uh, I don't have the number, um, off the top of my head, but, um, you know, we, um, we've been chipping away, but it's, uh, it's really dependent on, you know, the applicants and, um, so there's not kind of a consistent increase in our affordable housing stock. Okay. Just like 1, 3, 10, 30, a hundred, 300, it's
▶ 2:10:23 Robb Stewart: Like three a year, something like that. Okay. So it's fairly, fairly small. Small, yes. Okay. And we have, we've had some, um, the 40 B comprehensive permits, which have, um, 25% of the units. So those do have, have more, um, mm-hmm. You know, once you permit a project, it doesn't always get built or it doesn't always get built right away. So there's kind of a, um, a lag from permitting until actually seeing the units, um, that, you know, residents can occupy. Right, right. Thanks. So, yeah, I think it's a good thing that, um, you are raising this money, uh, to help people, uh, that would otherwise not be able to, uh, afford. And I think that's, that's the right motion. Uh, the concern that I have is that it, um,
▶ 2:11:17 Robb Stewart: as it was alluded to, it's we're fairly immature in this process and, uh, it, the value of money, uh, especially for these kinds of, uh, projects, if it's gonna be any kind of development projects, you said, you know, you're basically, uh, you're discounting 30% a year, uh, or 30% over the last three years. Right? Uh, so you're discounting, I don't know, like eight, 9% a year. Right. If, if, um, you do the numbers, um, I feel as though if we're going to be putting money into this and we're gonna have a discount rate where we really don't get to decide for the next six to 12 months, I'd rather have that money being used for something else of benefit for the city. And then when you come to free cash
▶ 2:12:06 Robb Stewart: and you recertify next year, that money's still there. So, I don't know, I'm, I'm a little torn as well, um, because I, you know, I see the benefit, but I'm just concerned that, uh, you don't have, don't really have plan, you don't have metrics. Uh, it, it, it's really, you just, you're trying to build up money for ideas, but they're not well formed. So convince me otherwise that it's further along, please, I won't try to convince you. I think I'll flip the narrative, which is, I think the challenge for the trust is developing ideas without an understanding of how much money, the scale of what we're talking about, and without any consistent regular appropriation into that trust is, I think is a challenge.
▶ 2:12:53 Jen Grigoraitis: And so for the, for the board to decide, you know, do we wanna do first time home buyer assistance? You obviously wanna look at maximize the money to help as many people as possible. And so if we know we only have 600,000 and that's what it's taken us 10 years to build up, then obviously we wanna think about how do you spend down that money in a way that it's not all gone in one quick moment. So I think it's a little bit of a both and to know what's a avail, like the scope of what we're gonna do is partly gonna be determined by what is available to do it with. Um, so, and I recognize they think they've been working really hard, and I think you all fully approved them in like January, February.
▶ 2:13:35 Jen Grigoraitis: They started working with math housing in March. The hope is to have a fully developed strategic plan, um, which will include community engagement in the fall. Um, it's just that this is the moment in time where funding what is really our only source of municipal funding is available. Um, so I recognize the imperfectness of that and, um, you know, we'll certainly think about it again, but it's also to decide how we can do this without knowing how much we have to do things with, I think is a little bit of a, a conundrum. Sure. And and was this communicated to them earlier, or is this, um, in terms of that budget, a budget would be available to them through free cash? Or was this more of discovery based on recent, uh,
▶ 2:14:20 Jen Grigoraitis: activities and planning? So one of the recommendations of MAs housing was to talk about what are, how is funding coming into the trust? And again, as a community that doesn't have CPA, that is, you know, I think that is the primary driver in most places for funding affordable housing. So we talked about what are the avenues that are available. One that was mentioned that other communities, I dunno how many have used, is free cash. So I said that I was willing to put forward a request to this body on behalf of the trust. Okay. Great. And flipping over to the account balance, you said that, um, the recommendation was to be at 500,000 or just non-zero For dl? Sorry, for free, free cash. Yes. Um, no, the recommendation,
▶ 2:15:04 Robb Stewart: It was just not To be at zero. Not to be at zero, Not to be at zero, which we went to zero last. Okay. So not five. Okay. So it wasn't $500,000, you just said it. We tried to be around 500,000. We Kept it at around, I mean, it's just under, um, we were targeting 500,000. Um, okay. And so that wouldn't have even been 10% of free cash. Um, Right. And so this will bring it down to four 16 is what you said. Right. So currently the balance with this order before you is 4 16, 6 68, if, depending on how this order goes, if it's not approved 150, So three six would be added. So Okay, so 2 68, 5 66. Yeah. And then, yeah. Yeah. Okay. Um, okay. Well, I have a decision to make, Um, just as an aside, I, you know, everyone talks about CPA, um,
▶ 2:15:57 Robb Stewart: and I do appreciate the value for an individual town, but what I find about the irony of CPA is that the towns that least need it, uh, gets the most benefit from it. And I think it's inequitable. Um, I've talked to, um, uh, Senator Lewis about it. I think it's, uh, something that needs to be result at the state issue at the state level. Um, and which is why I don't support it. 'cause um, I have an ethical issue with CPA and I don't think it's, uh, correctly allocating money for people that can get the most benefit from it. Thank you, Mr. Chair. Thank you. Council ro? Yes. Thank you. Uh, chair Carpe, I just wanna say thank you, um, for the chair, the thoughtful conversation we're having about this.
▶ 2:16:42 Cal Finocchiaro: Um, and I do think it's a really important, um, this trust is really important for our community. Um, and I just wanted to come back to some comments that have been made about, um, appropriating money. And we're not really sure, you know, what's gonna be done with it. I, we have done that several times, um, around this horseshoe, whatever you want me to call it. Um, you know, we've appropriated money for a design or for a, a van for Council on Aging, and that has not, no bids have been made. So we, we have appropriated money when we haven't really had a full amount, you know, full knowledge about what, where it's going and what's, what's going on that. Um, so I just wanna make that comment.
▶ 2:17:21 Jen Grigoraitis: But also, um, can you just clarify the, the money that's there that is from previous appropriations from the council? So It's, there was, there's been one appropriation from council of 75,000, 2020, Um, I believe it was 2021. 2021. And then the remainder of that has been the payments in lieu, um, that have been made by developers. So particularly if you build fewer than eight units, your choice is either to put part of a unit, unit into to be affordable, which is obviously very logistically challenging. Um, so then there's usually a payment made by the developer. And because the city didn't have the code in place to have the trust established, that money just sort of sat in an account that couldn't be used
▶ 2:18:06 Manjula Karamcheti: for anything else, but also couldn't be used for this until this body went through the process of setting that up. Okay. Thank you. I mean, like a few councils here, I'm kinda struggling with this because obviously we're at the end of this with the appropriations, and clearly we need the money, um, in our budget. But, um, I appreciate like the conversation that we're having here. And so, anyways, thanks Councilor Chedi, Uh, thank you chair, and thank you. I am also really appreciating this conversation, and I too am very supportive of affordable housing and this trust, and I feel like you've, we've all named the conundrum. Mm-hmm. It's just very hard to approve something when we're not sure what's
▶ 2:18:52 Manjula Karamcheti: gonna happen with the funds. Um, so I think what I would love, and I I think you've maybe hinted at it, but I would love, like, if we didn't approve this, what would be the impact? The money would not go into the trust. And so, did I understand you correctly in that the, the, the team coming with the strategic plan would have to perhaps shift how they allocated the money and how they did it because the, that this particular money wasn't there? Correct. I mean, I think there would be, again, I think they would, we would scale the plan toward the funding that's available, and knowing how long it took for that 600,000 to build up. And I also wanna say I $150,000 I like is not going to, fundamentally, it's not gonna build
▶ 2:19:44 Jen Grigoraitis: multiple units of new housing. Like we recom. We thought that this was sort of a reasonable amount to, you know, as part and when you look at the totality of where we've appropriated free cash across the needs of the community. Um, so I think it would be kind of shifting the plan. I also, I'm on the board, so I'll offer this on their behalf. I think regardless of how this goes here, I I think they would be happy to come before you all with an update on their plan and what, you know, their process for that. Um, I do know that like many of our other boards and commissions, the actual decision about how this money will get dispersed will be made by that board, um, as appointed by you all within the confines
▶ 2:20:21 Jen Grigoraitis: of state and local law. So I don't know that they'll ever be coming back to say, we wanna take this $50,000 and do X because the money is either coming in directly to the trust or has already been appropriated by you all. Got it. Thank you. That's just helpful in terms of impact and understanding where either decision would leave us. They're very excited and they're very passionate. They do meet on Monday nights, but I think they can around that. Um, councilor Armo, Uh, thank you very much. Uh, I really appreciate the, the conversation around the table here. I'm, um, like Councillor Williams, I, I do a lot of housing work in my day job and work with a lot of land banks and affordable housing trust funds and housing departments,
▶ 2:21:01 Devin Romanul: and recognize that we are in a national regional statewide crisis and, and housing and affordability, um, both in construction and, and how much it costs. And, and I sympathize. I am really torn that, um, you know, uh, going before community and talking about how much we're spending in this moment and where it sits in our community conversation about finances. And I, I was really on the am really on the fence, but I think where I come down is, I'm, I'm thinking about the folks in in our city who talk about the fear of raising taxes and, uh, the affordability, what it takes to come here and stay here. Um, and I think if we can make it just a little bit easier for some folks who want to be here, who wanna be, uh,
▶ 2:21:47 Devin Romanul: a member of our community, I, I think this is a piece of the puzzle. It's a step in the right direction. I get that 150 is not gonna break the bank, um, or not gonna, you know, meaningfully move the needle on the regional housing issue. Um, but I, I thought about, you know, what, if there's a, a teacher or a cop or a firefighter in our city who maybe is taking less pay to be here, um, maybe, uh, you know, the other, or surrounding, um, school districts or police departments or fire departments who might pay, you know, 10, 15 K more and they're looking to stay here or buy here, um, that this could be a really meaningful tool in our tool belt to attract or retain public sector employees where we are.
▶ 2:22:30 Devin Romanul: Our hands are tied in other areas, and I, I, I just can't stop thinking about that person. And I think that's where I come down. Um, and I, I think it maybe starts a conversation about the Community Preservation Act and, um, you know, the state legislative fixes aside. And, and I, I don't necessarily disagree. I I, Yeah. I I think that's, uh, I think that's where I come down. And I, I, I wanted to ask, I, since I should be using this time to ask a question rather than bloviate, but I, I, I wanted to ask, are there communities that are utilizing the Community Preservation Act in your estimation to the fullest that are sort of similar size that have a, uh, more well thought out housing policy in, in this regard?
▶ 2:23:13 Or, or is there a, a direction we could be, we could be headed? So, Uh, we work a lot with Malden because we're on the, um, the home consortium and they're the lead city. So, um, they've recently got their trust up and running and, um, so we've, you know, we work very closely with them and, um, bounce ideas off of each other. And they've, um, you know, they've, um, been, um, gotten, you know, affordable units, um, funded. And, um, so, you know, that's one example. Um, and, um, I also just, I, I don't think I made clear some of the, um, points about these units. The, the money that would go into, uh, a deed restricted affordable unit. Um, those units would be affordable in perpetuity. Um, and there's regulations about, um, incomes for,
▶ 2:24:08 you know, people that would be eligible for those units. So there's this plan that we need to, um, you know, solidify, but at the same time, there are a lot of regulations, um, that, that are in place that, you know, we're, we're following. So it's not just kind of like giving, um, this group a large amount of money and they can kind of like willy nilly kind of like choose what they wanna do with it. So, um, I don't think I gave enough kind of context around that piece of it. Um, and so there are, you know, communities that are using the, the money for that purpose and, um, you know, some of these projects could be using the federal home funds, um, to help support the creation of affordable housing.
▶ 2:24:54 Jen Grigoraitis: Um, and so this is just a piece of, um, the ability to, to put together projects, um, and programs because they do need a whole bunch of support, um, from different, um, areas in order to, to function. Just to piggyback on Lori, um, 'cause she mentioned the federal government, I, again, $150,000 is not gonna solve the housing crisis. I recognize that, but we're also very concerned about the potential changes in federal funding to hud, which is the Melrose Housing Authority, um, is our largest public, um, source of affordable housing. And there, right now, the current proposal before Congress is to significantly reduce the budget, um, at the federal level. So this is, again, as we think about
▶ 2:25:37 Jen Grigoraitis: what are the tools we have in our toolbox sometimes to respond to things that are totally out of our control, I do think that's something that the, um, trust is looking at very closely about will we have fewer units available in Melrose in the future because of the, um, if the federal government pulls back from funding affordable housing? Yeah, no, I, I appreciate both of those, um, comments. And yeah, I think, I think I come down on, if there are people who are pumping their fist wanted to be here, uh, especially if they're public servant in some way, I, I wanna help 'em. So that's where I'm at, president Mig Lee Earley. Thank you, Mr. Chair. Um, just to Councilor, car Shay's point of what would happen if this money doesn't
▶ 2:26:15 go in, uh, I just wanna ask, since Ms. Golden has is at the table now, um, can you explain what happens really with free cash that doesn't get appropriated? Because I, I think some of the conversation around the table is almost like, well, it goes back in and it's gonna be available Exactly, you know, next year. So, you know, it's fine. We'll make a decision later when we have more time. My understanding over the last six years of serving on the councils, that's not exactly how that works. So would you re-explain that for us and people at home? Sure. So, um, at the end of the year, historically, we have appropriated all free cash. So our starting fund balance is zero this year. We're not appropriating that 416,000,
▶ 2:26:56 so our starting balance would be four 16, but then all of the revenues that are collected in the general fund, and then all of the expenditures close out to fund balance. And so you could have a year where revenues exceed expenses or vice versa. Um, but that becomes the beginning fund balance. And then, um, DLS comes in and they look at your receivables. Um, they look at any funds that are in deficit. So if you have a grant, and we haven't received, um, those funds, um, police detail is an account, it's an agency account where, um, police details are paid, but we're prepaying the officer. And so those receivables have to be collected. Um, so I have found like every five years, DLS or not, DLS, uh, DOR will, um, hold, hold that against us.
▶ 2:27:49 Leila Migliorelli: Um, they don't do it every year, but they look at deficit funds and they decide how, um, what funds they're going to, uh, ding us for as far as free cash. And so, I mean, my predecessor, Patrick LaRusso will always say free cash can be negative. Communities do get a negative free cash certified. Um, but that's, that's essentially like a high level overview. Thank you. I think that's, that helps explain, like, my philosophy with free cash is that we have an opportunity, um, and we can't allocate free cash, but the mayor can come to us with proposals and we can accept them by not accepting them. Doesn't really necessarily put money in the bank for us for another day, just based on what you said.
▶ 2:28:36 Leila Migliorelli: So it's a risk, it's a risk to not have that money there next year. So, um, again, like unless there was some, you know, ridiculous expenditure, which I don't think an affordable funding and affordable housing trust is, that's kind of how my position goes along, um, with the, the wonderful Bloviation by Counselor Romano about what could happen and who we could help support. Um, I think that's, you know, my like fiscal mentality is, you know, why not support the opportunity that's in front of us, um, because we, we have actual choice in this, um, with this money. So thank you. Thank you council, uh, council Vandiver, and then Councilor Williams. Thank you Chair Ro. Um, along that line of questioning, uh,
▶ 2:29:17 Kimberly Vandiver: so the free cash, this money, this particular money, if, if not allocated is in the free cash bucket, if still, if it is allocated, goes to the trust, um, I wanted to ask the CFO whether, um, that money when it's sitting in either of those accounts, since we are in the business at the moment of looking at every single dollar, if it earns interest differently in either of those accounts? Yes. So, uh, the Affordable Housing Trust is invested with Bartholomew. They manage, um, all of our, um, funds like stabilization, uh, capital, um, all of those larger funds. They manage that under the context of mass general law and what's allowable. And then, um, all of our general, uh, cash, our treasurer collector is always trying
▶ 2:30:07 Kimberly Vandiver: to make sure we're earning interest on everything. So everything's always being, um, invested in making sure that we have liquidity to pay what we have, uh, due. Okay. So regardless, it may be invested differently, but it would, it would not be sitting exactly somewhere. It would, it would be in a fund that's managed and, um, attempting to get interest if it can. Yes. Okay, great. And, um, yeah, I, I, I mean, I also appreciated through the chair councilor remodels discussion. I know people talk about, um, when you're making a decision about something, you need to be convinced both your heart and your mind and, you know, he spoke to the kind of the heart side of things. Um, I think from a numbers perspective, um, you know,
▶ 2:30:53 Ryan Williams: this very roughly speaking would be 0.1% of our budget. I think, if I'm doing my math correctly in the moment, which I, I believe, correct me if I'm not this, for the average homer, this would be 10 bucks basically on their yearly bill, is what we're talking about. Um, if that helps anybody on the numbers side. Thank You, council Williams. Yeah, thank you. Um, So I really appreciate everybody's conversation here. I particularly appreciated President Migli a's refresher thanks to, um, CFO about the risks of not approving free cash. This is the same argument I made when I was arguing against cutting the tree budget, because sometimes you may cuts and things don't come back, right? So I appreciate that.
▶ 2:31:40 Ryan Williams: Um, sometimes you have an opportunity to do something and you might not have that opportunity in the future. Um, I, I think the, I think the challenge that some of us are facing is that, like, unlike other boards and commissions, we're giving a lot of money to a new thing that hasn't really demonstrate, ha hasn't shown us what they're gonna do yet. So it's a leap of faith. Um, I am particular to leaps of faith. I kind of appreciate them because I think sometimes you have to give people a little leeway, um, to see what they can do. So I'm gonna support this order tonight. Um, I have been burned in the past by having faith in things and then turning out that they weren't so good. But there's a lot of good, smart people around the table,
▶ 2:32:31 Ryan Williams: um, doing this work. So, um, I would really like to see in the near future the plan here, because there's so much diversity in affordable housing. You know, are we talking about paths to home ownership? Are we talking about people with rent burdens, right? Because renters, you know, in, in Melrose, um, can be kind of a blind spot for people on the council. Uh, none of you know, none of us are renters. Um, so I just, I, I, I, it's exciting work. I wanna know more about it. I think the CPA is the only way that we can make meaningful progress on this, but, uh, presented the opportunity. I will support giving the trust some cash to see what they can do. Thank you. Councilor Firo. I'm okay. Thanks.
▶ 2:33:19 Mark Garipay: What's that? All set? Uh, anyone else? Council Aldi, I would make a motion to recommend. Second, we have a motion to recommend by Council Aldi, seconded by councilor, I mean, president Elli. If I could just, um, listen into everyone's conversation. I'm struggling like everyone else. Um, with with not having a plan, I'm more of a risk taker, um, and kind of a, a saver. And, um, I'm kind of leaning towards, um, not supporting this. Um, not because I'm not for affordable housing. I think, um, we have a few months to see what the plan, what the plan is gonna be, um, when they come back in the fall. I understand we do have some money in there that we can do some things with, but, um, I think historically, um,
▶ 2:34:15 Mark Garipay: my position over the last six years on the council has been kind of a saver. And, and, and let's see, see where, uh, see where we end up. So, um, so with that being said on discussion, um, Madam Clerk, can you please call the role? Yes. Councilor Jamal Ledine? Yes. Counselor Occhio? No. Counselor Hamilton? No. Counselor. Kara Chetty? Yes. Counselor Romano? Yes. Counselor Stewart? No. Counselor Vandiver? Yes. Counselor Williams? Yes. President Elli? Yes. Chair Garipay? No. That will be recommended to the full council. Thank you. Um, Uh, what am I doing here? Next up, sorry. That's okay. Uh, we're done with, uh, number two. We're on to appropriation request for FY 2026. Budget. Uh, ID 1, 2, 6, 7, 8
▶ 2:35:30 Maya Jamaleddine: fiscal year 2026. Operating budget in the amount of $107,575,802. This is our final vote. Motion. Motion Recommend. Second, Have a motion to recommend id. 1 2, 6, 7 8 fiscal year 2026. Operating budget in the amount of $107,575,802 made by President Elli. Seconded by, um, uh, vice Chair Jamal Dean on discussion. Vice Chi. Jamal, Thank you. Um, I wanted to thank you for leading this year's. Uh, um, it was A fa it was so much fun. I know. We, uh, I'm so, um, grateful. It, you know, it's definitely by far not the budget that we, I can speak for my colleagues and please allow me to do so. It's not the budget that we are hoping, uh, to approve. Um, and it's not the services and resources that we are hoping to be able to provide, uh,
▶ 2:36:42 Maya Jamaleddine: for our residents and cons, constituents. Um, we, I do, um, acknowledge that, um, every department is running on very stretched and, and thin budget. And some, uh, and many are under budgeted. Um, I do hope that next year will be, uh, different and will be able to provide to the, uh, public, uh, and more efficient and, uh, well budgeted department and, um, balanced. Um, thank you. Thank you. Vice Chair Jamal Ledine. Anyone else on discussion? Madam Clerk, can you please call the role? Yes. Vice Chair Jamal Ledine? Yes. Counselor Occhio? Yes. Counselor Hamilton? No. Counselor. Caram Chetty? Yes. Counselor Romano? Yes. Counselor Stewart? Yes. Counselor Vandiver? Yes. Counselor Williams? Yes. President Elli?
▶ 2:37:50 Mark Garipay: Yes. Chair Garipay. Yes. That will be recommended for passage. Next up, we have ordinances id. 1, 2, 6, 7, 5 reauthorization of the City of Melrose Revolving fund table for fiscal 2026. Mr. Chair, I'll make a motion to recommend this to the full counsel. Second, We have a motion to recommend id. 1, 2, 6, 7, 5 reauthorization of the cedar of MO'S revolving fund table for fiscal 2026, made by Councilor Stewart. Seconded by council, uh, vice Chair Jamine. Our discussion. Madam Clerk, can you please call the role? Yes. Vice Chair Jamine? Yes. Councilor fro? Yes. Counselor Hamilton? Yes. Counselor. Kara Chetty? Yes. Counselor Romano? Yes. Counselor Stewart? Yes. Counselor Vandiver? Yes. Counselor Williams? Yes.
▶ 2:38:41 Mark Garipay: President Elli? Yes. Chair Garipay? Yes. Um, moving on, um, that will be recommended to the full board. Uh, moving on, we have orders id. 1, 2, 6, 7 oh Revok, the provisions of Mass General Law. Chapter 44. Section 53 F ceasing the operation of the ambulance Enterprise fund. Effective fiscal year 2026. Beginning July 1st, 2025. And I believe Ms. Golden, were you, do you have anything to say on this? Or are we, you don't have to. I wasn't sure if I had it down that you were sorry. Yes. Sorry, you don't. So I think I talked about this, uh, under 2 31 budget, but, um, this is just a housekeeping item with the ambulance moving to a private contract. Uh, it's to revoke the original, uh, enterprise fund.
▶ 2:39:37 Maya Jamaleddine: Beautiful. I would make motion to revoke, um, the provision of MGL Chapter 44. What year? Second id, 1, 2, 6, 7, 0. Okay. We have a motion to second revoke. Second by council if may by vice chair. Maldi. Seconded by council fro on discussion. Mr. Chair. Um, just clarity, we voting to recommend the revocation, or are we voting to revoke? We are voting to recommend one, two, second. The revocation. Okay. 1, 2, 6, 7, 0. That revokes the revision. Okay, great. Thank you. It's just, just the way that I framed it. Okay. Thank you. On discussion, Madam Clerk, can you please call the role? Yes. For the last time, vice Chair Jamine? Yes. Counselor Occhio? Yes. Counselor Hamilton? Yes. Counselor. Kara Chetty? Yes. Counselor Romano? Yes. Counselor Stewart?
▶ 2:40:28 Yes. Counselor Vandiver? Yes. Counselor Williams? Yes. President Melli? Yes. Chair Garate? Yes. That will be recommended. Anyone? Motion to adjourn. Second. Second. Motion to adjourn made by President Melli. Seconded by, um, council Williams, or, uh, on discussion. All in favor? Aye. Adjourned.