APPRO-2025-21 : An Appropriation from Free Cash (account 01-324001) in the amount of $150,000 to DPW Facilities (#402) for repairs to the Franklin School all purpose room.

Transcript (~18 min @ 1:36:03)

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▶ 1:36:03 Mark Garipay: That will be recommended. Next up ID 1 2 6 3 8. An appropriation from free cash account 0 1 3 2 4 0 0 1 in the amount of 150,000 to DPW facilities to, for repairs, to the Franklin School. All Purpose Room.

▶ 1:36:20 Speaker 9: Thank you. So this one would be a complete rehab of the All Purpose Room. Um, a couple years ago there were some ceiling tiles that were falling and there was a lot of concern from, uh, school staff about, you know, the safety for children. They're not large or heavy tiles, but it, it is certainly an issue. Um, and something that we don't want, you know, we don't want in a school. Um, at the time we had looked at a proposed project to replace the ceiling, and then we determined that there's asbestos wrapped pipe above the ceiling and there's asbestos floor tile in the room. And so at that point, Jay McNeil had recommended that we do all the asbestos remediation, redo the ceiling, the floor, um, and then some other ancillary items. I know painting, um, replacement of the window treatments, the lights and the stage curtains, um, which is the, those ladder items are a smaller component of the total cost. But if we're in there doing the floor, the ceiling, and taking the asbestos off of the pipes, you know, once we're sort of dismantling the whole room, it makes sense to rehab the whole thing.

▶ 1:37:34 Speaker 5: Any questions? Council ro?

▶ 1:37:37 Cal Finocchiaro: Um, thank you. I went to the Franklin School 75 years ago, and if it still looks the same, it would say it definitely needs to be replaced. Um, that being said, we have a lot of old schools in Melrose. Um, I'm thinking of the Winthrop and like the hardest, um, do those fall in line? Are they as bad? How did you choose Franklin?

▶ 1:38:00 Speaker 9: Yeah, the Horseman had a major upgrade about, I would say eight years ago. Mm-hmm. Um, so all of the immediate needs have been addressed there. There are some, like the all-purpose room at the Horseman doesn't look great. Mm-hmm. But at least the immediate needs have been addressed. Um, the Hoover all purpose room is exactly the same as the Franklin same age, same condition. And so originally when we put this project into our CIP several years ago, we actually proposed doing both. Um, possibly doing both at once to try to get some economies of scale with, you know, putting it out to bid altogether. Um, but where the Franklin is, where we have had actual falling tiles that kind of bumped that one higher up on the list. Um, so it's been fairly high on our, our capital improvement list for a while now. The Winthrop needs a major overhaul. Okay. And I think, you know, based on the financial state of the city, it, it's very difficult to say what should be done next. And we have that school master plan that's happening now. They've been doing walkthroughs of all the schools. They're looking at both conditions and demographics, and hopefully they're gonna come up with recommendations as to timing with like an MSBA core project mm-hmm. To either completely replace the Winthrop or to completely renovate it. Um, or they just say, you know, replace the roof through an MSBA project and then chip away at it like we have with other, other projects. But a lot of this comes back to the same thing we talk about all the time, which is deferred maintenance. We have deferred maintenance in every one of our school buildings, and we're in the habit of attacking things piecemeal. Mm-hmm. And so we have projects like this. We have projects like the, the one we're gonna be talking about later at the Franklin. Um, you know, if we don't do major investment mm-hmm. Then we have to do these little projects all the time.

▶ 1:39:56 Speaker 1: I agree. And, um, you have a bid for this already, or?

▶ 1:39:59 Speaker 9: So we have quotes. Um, Jay had had recommended that we do that we work with several different, um, state contract vendors. Mm-hmm. So he had obtained quotes for the asbestos removal, separate quote for the new floor installation, um, and ceiling installation. And then our electrician, our on-call electrician would do the lighting. Mm-hmm. Um, and I have to look and see if he had quotes already for the window treatments, but he had gathered all the information and had given the cost estimate based on a whole bunch of different vendors doing different pieces. Great.

▶ 1:40:34 Cal Finocchiaro: Well, I support this only because I, I think that we don't do a good job. Well, it's because fiscally we don't have the money to invest to rehab, you know, a full room where, like you said, we're always patching. Um, and this is what we need to start doing in the years to come, especially with these old buildings. So, um, I'd like to make a motion to recommend.

▶ 1:40:55 Speaker 10: I'll second,

▶ 1:40:57 Mark Garipay: We have a motion to recommend by council ro seconded by counselor Che. Uh, on discussion I have Councilor Jamal Ledine, and then Councilor Hamilton.

▶ 1:41:09 Speaker 9: Thank you. Good evening. Um, good evening.

▶ 1:41:10 Maya Jamaleddine: So you mentioned that we do, uh, have right now asbestos in the, uh, at the Franklin the school in the, uh, on the ceiling. Right.

▶ 1:41:20 Speaker 9: It's, uh, pipe insulation up above the ceiling, but also we have a lot of asbestos floor tile throughout the school district.

▶ 1:41:28 Speaker 2: So is it exposed?

▶ 1:41:29 Speaker 9: It is exposed, but it's not, um, you know, it's fryable asbestos that is a problem. So it's when it becomes damaged and that's when it becomes, you know, it can get into the air and it can be inhaled. So every time we have any damage to an asbestos tile area, we replace it.

▶ 1:41:49 Maya Jamaleddine: So currently we don't have that situation on the floor or any tile area?

▶ 1:41:55 Speaker 9: No, we do have that situation inside one closet, in one classroom right now that got water damaged about two months ago.

▶ 1:42:02 Maya Jamaleddine: Okay. And, um, uh, if this, you know, hopefully passes, when would this project would take place?

▶ 1:42:08 Speaker 9: We would hopefully be able to do it this summer.

▶ 1:42:11 Speaker 2: Okay. And, um, I,

▶ 1:42:13 Maya Jamaleddine: and um, I may be totally wrong, but is there any summer, um, programs that are run?

▶ 1:42:21 Speaker 9: No. This summer the programming will all be at the Roosevelt.

▶ 1:42:25 Maya Jamaleddine: Okay. So there is nothing that's going to happen at the Franklins Yes.

▶ 1:42:28 Speaker 9: Accurate, right? Correct. Yeah. Okay.

▶ 1:42:32 Maya Jamaleddine: And, um, how would the remedy remediation going to happen as for the asbestos and especially to ensure that when students are back, everything is clear and, and so communication with the parents as well?

▶ 1:42:48 Speaker 9: Yeah, so we actually, communication with the parents isn't an easy one. We send out an annual letter in September, um, that's a state requirement, um, through the asbestos. It's the Hara program. I don't, do you know what that, the acronym? Yeah. Um, there,

▶ 1:43:03 Speaker 5: It's there, it's right here.

▶ 1:43:04 Speaker 9: Oh, asbestos. Oh, I even put in the memo. Well, I put in the asbestos memo. Asbestos Hazard Emergency Response Act requires us to send an annual letter to the parents. Um, so we do that anyway, describing any work that we've done and that we'll be doing. Um, the entire room or the entire building would, if we're working in different areas too, because we also have the asbestos, um, order gets, uh, isolated the, you have to hire a specialty contractor who is licensed to do this work. You also have to have a contractor as separate consultant who does air quality monitoring. And so that happens throughout the project. Um, and then everything gets thoroughly cleaned before, um, before taking down the isolation curtains. Um, and then obviously the new floor would be installed and new ceiling would be installed. So there wouldn't be, you know, all the asbestos containing material would be removed from the site. And

▶ 1:44:05 Maya Jamaleddine: It would be, uh, obviously this, uh, everything would be disposed at a, um, designated, uh, place disposal. Right. Yes. And, um, is there, once this project is complete, do we still have, um, other places or areas that do contain asbestos? Yes. And is that, and is this a, um, at, at Franklin? I'm talking just, uh, at Franklin. Yes. So are we, do we have a plan to continue like, uh, phase two or?

▶ 1:44:40 Speaker 9: Yeah, so the, the later order about asbestos removal is for a hundred thousand dollars to continue on our, we're in a constant state of replacement. Um, one thing that Jay McNeil brought to the city that I think was a real benefit is that he essentially would not do just one area of a classroom because the bulk of the cost is in setting up the isolation equipment. Um, and then removing the whole floor is not a large additional cost compared to removing half the floor. So any asbestos removal that was done while he was here, we did whole classrooms, whole hallways. Um, so a large portion of the asbestos at the Franklin has now been replaced, but we still have a few areas that that need to be replaced.

▶ 1:45:24 Maya Jamaleddine: Okay. So it's a, it's a good, uh, news that a larger, uh, area has been replaced. So we have hopefully smaller area, uh, to be worked at. Right. Yeah,

▶ 1:45:37 Speaker 9: I think, um, I think in the other memo,

▶ 1:45:41 Speaker 5: Um, I think the best way to answer that though is that although if you could make a general assessment that anything built before, let's just say 1980, you're probably gonna have asbestos in some of the building materials. But what we don't have is we don't have an imminent threat to any of our students in this city. What we have is we have a plan and then we have, uh, everything that we have to follow in terms of compliance to keep moving forward, to make sure we not only minimize, but also remove any immediate threat as it comes up. So it's kind of a combination of, uh, what's going on with this, uh, all purpose room. And then, uh, the next, uh, the next order that's, that will be in front of you.

▶ 1:46:24 Maya Jamaleddine: Okay. And, um, and thank you for that. And, uh, is that, you know, once we, uh, start this project, um, is it going to be, um, are we going to adopt like a newer, um, uh, you know, like flooring and all the other stuff to, um, so that the whole thing would be renovating following this new, uh, room? Or is It following the old design?

▶ 1:46:50 Speaker 9: So we typically install, install vinyl tile, um, standard like 12 by 12 vinyl tiles, um, that we strip and wax every summer before the school year starts. So we would continue on with that. We've, we've been, that's been the standard of what's been installed for probably decades at this point.

▶ 1:47:09 Speaker 2: Okay. Well thank you

▶ 1:47:11 Ward Hamilton: Councilor Hamilton. Thank you. Thank you for being here tonight. And thank you for all of the work you do. Caring for our infrastructure. It's our largest asset. We appreciate that. Um, just last Monday, which seems like forever ago, uh, we appropriated, uh, 250,000 in free cash for feasibility studies for projects at the Franklin and the high school. Um, and we've got three free cash appropriations in front of us tonight that are going towards work at the Franklin. Um, just a question, uh, would we do the study first and then plan the work? Or are these things that are outside the scope of that study?

▶ 1:47:57 Speaker 9: So the study is for the building envelope project, so focusing on roof masonry windows and doors. So it's really all exterior. So the, the, um, study won't touch on any of the a PR or the asbestos. Okay.

▶ 1:48:16 Speaker 5: Thank you. Any other questions?

▶ 1:48:19 Mark Garipay: Um, I do have one quick one. Uh, with regards to the all purpose room that where this 150 thousands going, um, ceiling tiles, was that the what I heard on this or was this just asbestos on the all purpose or There was a number of things, right? Ceiling tiles,

▶ 1:48:35 Speaker 9: Yeah, ceiling tiles, window treatments, painting floor lighting, curtains, curtains.

▶ 1:48:41 Mark Garipay: Did we have leaks in that over the all purpose room or do we, that would've caused the damage? And why would we be doing the, I mean, I understand the asbestos, but if we haven't done the, the roof, the $250,000 study on the roof, I'm just questioning why this is before us without knowing.

▶ 1:49:03 Speaker 9: That is a good question. We have, we've been repairing the roof at the Franklin for years, um, doing spot repairs. I'm not aware of any current or recent leaks in the all-purpose room. Um, I am aware of leaks though, that have happened in the hallway that's, uh, near the all purpose room.

▶ 1:49:27 Speaker 9: Uh, that is a good question. If you

▶ 1:49:29 Speaker 5: Have any thoughts. There's nothing major that is out there and, uh, posing as a, as a threat that would compromise anything that we would do here. The one nice thing that we have now is one of our tradespeople is actually specialized in roof. He has a history in roof repair. So we've actually come a long way in being able to handle a lot of that, a lot of that stuff in house. And he brings with him, uh, extensive knowledge on how to take care of the rubber roofs. Uh, and any shingle roofs, the ballast roofs, they, they stay, uh, quite a bit of a challenge. Yeah. So

▶ 1:50:03 Mark Garipay: I understand that. My concern would be that we do this work and then we, a leak appears like we like the high school gym, you know, I mean that, that's leaking again and buckling and you know, the floors. So that's, that's just my concern with, with this. I understand. We, we kind of have to do it. We have asbestos there, but it's sounds, it seems like we're putting the copy for the horse on, on some of this stuff. And I know we've had delayed maintenance on a lot of things, but, um, I, I'm struggling with, with this one right now, to be honest with you. But what's the will of the, um, the committee? It is, there's already a motion. It Is already the motion. I'm sorry. You're right. We have, I have it, I have, it was, uh, motion by council ro second by council ache. Uh, anyone else wanna speak? Well,

▶ 1:50:55 Speaker 9: No, it's not. So through the chair or Through the chair? I, I just a follow up on that. So the, the feasibility study that's going on, is that going

▶ 1:51:03 Cal Finocchiaro: to look at the roofing in at Franklin? Yes. And so that's just a study. We don't actually have funds to actually replace roofs or

▶ 1:51:10 Speaker 9: That's, so the MSBA process, they would, they typically put up about half of the money if we get accepted into the MSBA program. Um, the first step is the study. Mm-hmm. And then that identifies the scope of the project. Mm-hmm. The cost estimate. And then we would be looking at whether the city can fund its half, roughly half of the project. Mm-hmm. So until we get to that point, we don't know if we have a project that we can afford. Mm-hmm. Um, but that would be, those would be the steps toward replacing the roof.

▶ 1:51:46 Speaker 1: Okay. And that could be a few years from now potentially, or,

▶ 1:51:50 Speaker 9: Um, hopefully if we got into the program, it would be next summer. Mm-hmm. At the latest it would be the following summer.

▶ 1:52:00 Cal Finocchiaro: And just to reiterate, you haven't experienced like, leaking in the all-purpose room?

▶ 1:52:05 Speaker 9: Not to my knowledge. Okay. Um, We do a walkthrough at the end of every school year and identify the list of projects and the roof over the all-purpose room is not one that I recall ever mm-hmm. Hearing about. But it is true that we have had ceiling tiles that fell, and oftentimes when you get that sort of damage, it is the result of water from mm-hmm. At some point historically. Um, I was gonna look real quick at the, we have the roof report from the architects, um, when they first looked at it, just to tell you at least what, what type of roof it is over the all purpose

▶ 1:52:43 Speaker 9: room, if you're interested. Mm-hmm.

▶ 1:52:46 Mark Garipay: Um, that's anyone else's? I'm, I'm, I'm good. We have a motion on the floor or we, or if you would like to get us more information, we could pull that and hold it. Whatever you, whatever you, whatever the will of the council is. We have a motion on the floor right now, so,

▶ 1:53:05 Speaker 9: So just, could I ask one more question?

▶ 1:53:09 Speaker 1: If we appropriate this money this evening? Um, actually forget it.

▶ 1:53:17 Mark Garipay: So, so if I, so if I heard you correctly, I'm sorry, counsel Lu, that this is the design is for the MSBA. Right. Which we're not sure if we're gonna get. Mm-hmm. So in essence, we're gonna have to probably do something with this room even if we don't get it right. Mm-hmm. Correct. Okay. Okay. Got it.

▶ 1:53:41 Speaker 5: Um, roll call. Vote