ORDER-2015-13 : Petition of National Grid to install 200'+/- of 4-4" PVC underground electric conduits on Upham Street from MH268 to Pole 2441 in accordance with plan #17233005 - marked Nationalgrid, dated 6/17/2014.

Transcript (~24 min @ 17:42)

Speakers identified by voice; unnamed voices are numbered within this recording. Auto-caption text — verify against the video.

▶ 17:46 Speaker 1: a public hearing that we have scheduled for this evening relative to order 2015-13

▶ 17:51 Monica C. Medeiros: that order which is currently on the table motion to commence the public hearing on order 2015-13

▶ 17:56 Speaker 1: alderman medeiros moves to commence public hearing on the order second second by alderman mortimer on the motion all those in favor aye anyone opposed and a motion to remove the order from the table

▶ 18:09 Speaker 1: mr president alderman mortimer moves to remove the order from the table second motion is seconded by alderman inferno on the motion all those in favor anyone opposed motion passes the order is removed from the table uh we're we will convene a public hearing on this order anybody who wishes to speak either for or against the order can come forward uh and speak good evening sir could you identify

▶ 18:42 Speaker 9: yourself please yes my name is michael vanitas representing national grid mr president point

▶ 18:45 John N. Tramontozzi: of order it may be appropriate to read the order into the record at this i'm not sure if we read it

▶ 18:55 Speaker 1: into the record this is a petition of national grid to install 200 feet plus or minus of 4-4 inch pbc underground electrical conduits on upland street from mh268 to pole 2441 in accordance with plans that are marked national grid grid 17233005 dated 6 17 214. thank you could you

▶ 19:21 Speaker 1: explain the work the placement of the work and the project please sir yeah the project is for

▶ 19:26 Speaker 9: some fiber optic cable will be rising up on that pole 224 41 basically what it's used for is for substations to communicate to each other in case there's any problems circuit goes out we can flop circuits remotely to kind of back feed people to um you know lessen outage times so that's what the the fiber optic cable

▶ 20:01 Speaker 1: okay can you describe what work is going to be necessary to do this um so we would dig

▶ 20:05 Speaker 9: in the sidewalk around 200 feet between those manholes install four four inch pvc pipe for our fiber optic cables then we would dig across the street about 50 feet to that pole to rise up with the fiber optic cables everything beyond that would be on overhead poles and if this

▶ 20:34 Speaker 1: grant of location is passed do you have a time frame pursuant to which this work would be done

▶ 20:45 Speaker 9: we would like to shoot for october it it depends on the the pole being replaced by verizon as well as the steel stub pole that it's connected to is which is also leaning we will also need to replace that before we can begin to construction okay sir if

▶ 21:03 Speaker 1: you could step back we're gonna ask anybody else who's here if they wish to speak and I think members of the board will probably have questions for you

▶ 21:12 Speaker 1: thereafter is there anybody else who wishes to speak relative to this order

▶ 21:29 Speaker 9: sir come forward please my name is Michael Quinn and we leased the space on 17 Upham Street which is right in front of the area that they're going to be digging and I'm just really concerned with how this is going to disrupt our business and for how long and what will National Grid do to accommodate us for getting any out of our place of business while they're

▶ 21:59 Speaker 1: doing the construction okay I'm sure that'll be addressed as we continue on okay thank you sir thank you mr. Street are you here to talk on this order

▶ 22:08 Speaker 1: relative from the public works perspective if you could please so we

▶ 22:25 Speaker 10: met with members of national grade to discuss the project I prepared the prepared a memo with the number of conditions one of which Mike touched on just a second ago the removal and replacement of that utility pole as well as the the secondary pole that that it's used to support the primary also the repair of the sidewalks we request that they repair from the curbing all the way to the back edge of the sidewalk and then to grind the trench in the street which is a more permanent and better trench repair upham street's not new in that section but it's still i feel it's appropriate to repair it as best as possible i believe those were my comments i'm happy to answer any questions that you may have as well

▶ 23:22 Speaker 1: yeah so okay is there anybody else who wishes to speak relative to this order before we open

▶ 23:31 Speaker 1: it up for questions okay questions for mr street please all the boys help there's been discussion

▶ 23:44 Robert A. Boisselle: of p2441 being replaced now the terminology replaced bothers me is that poll that's there now going to be removed and not just a second poll put in next to it i would like to see the

▶ 23:53 Speaker 10: poll removed and replaced yes perhaps the member of national grade could speak as well okay i'll

▶ 24:04 Speaker 3: be watching for that thank you thank you mr chairman right hi andy good to see you again

▶ 24:15 Francis X. Wright Jr.: one condition i placed on these conduit requests in the past and i'd like to see placed on this unless you have a reason not to is that the city have a reasonable opportunity to run it um cable through these conduits should it reasonably need to do so um because obviously if we at some point find ourselves in the position of having to run any type of cable through here we don't want to be tearing up our own streets and as we're giving them this opportunity to to lay this conduit i believe we should always condition these requests with a with the city having such an opportunity i think that makes sense yeah i'm happy to work

▶ 25:05 Francis X. Wright Jr.: with our utility companies to see if that's appropriate so mr president i would i intend to make a motion to add that as condition number six great thank you alderman mccarty margolis

▶ 25:15 Mary Beth McAteer-Margolis: um thank you mr chairman um i believe um the national grid representative said that they would also need to it was a verizon poll or something something about verizon you need

▶ 25:28 Speaker 11: Yes, the pole in Melrose, the poles are set by Verizon, so that wood pole that we're replacing, they would actually be setting the new pole.

▶ 25:35 Mary Beth McAteer-Margolis: Verizon would be setting the new pole? Yes. Okay. And have you communicated with them yet on that?

▶ 25:42 Speaker 11: I have. I spoke to them when I first designed the project, and again today.

▶ 25:51 Speaker 11: I'm just stressing that the pole is in really bad shape, so I'm stressing that sooner than later would be perfect.

▶ 25:56 Mary Beth McAteer-Margolis: And is it their intent to remove the old pole at the same time that they replace the new one?

▶ 26:06 Speaker 11: Not at the same time, because when they set the new pole, National Grid will go and will replace our wires. And then any cable, TV, or anything like that, they'll have to transfer their wires and rise them. the transfer there was a class and at that time we sort of have a history with

▶ 26:23 Mary Beth McAteer-Margolis: Verizon of these second polls kind of lingering so it would be appreciated if you could facilitate that in a timely manner just before we have any further

▶ 26:37 Gail Infurna: questions for the gentleman if you could maybe sit at the table so the folks at

▶ 26:47 Speaker 1: home yeah I actually I think we could go one person at a time it might actually

▶ 26:53 Mary Beth McAteer-Margolis: be better but that's fine my other question was for mr. Street this is a this is a really busy intersection but basically it's coming across Upham Street on Main Street and then going up up them is that correct it crosses Upham

▶ 27:05 Speaker 10: Street and then the rest of the work is in the sidewalk so yeah so across is right at Stevens place more or less okay and then there's in the sidewalk and the sidewalk is very wide so I don't see why they couldn't work on the sidewalk and perhaps restrict the lane slightly or something like that but it would

▶ 27:21 Mary Beth McAteer-Margolis: disrupt the traffic would there be a detour or would there and for how long

▶ 27:28 Speaker 10: do you anticipate I don't think a detour would be necessary we've done far bigger operations that have required a detour and I think we could probably work together to do half the street at a time where maybe a police officer on either side could successfully negotiate traffic in the area but the work in the street should be very quick I would think that's a date I mean you're only a few feet deep correct I mean it's it's a really shallow excavation it should be very quick to do the portion in the street and how are you gonna address the

▶ 27:54 Mary Beth McAteer-Margolis: neighbors the neighboring businesses concerns is that a question for me I'm

▶ 28:05 Speaker 9: sorry to um I mean that would be something that I could talk to the the civil guys about and see what they usually do on the electric side I'm not really familiar with how they usually handle that but I mean I'm sure they've done many of these before and helped out the businesses I would think there's an

▶ 28:28 Speaker 10: opportunity to just like in the street to stage the construction working from one side to the other so that there's not general disruption across the entire frontage which is something we continue to push them on to make sure there's access to that building it's a trade-off because we also want them to finish quickly and be out of there so that just minimizes disruptions as well but I think we could work something along those lines to to improve access and and try and keep pedestrians as much access as possible to that's a busy area I know

▶ 28:59 Mary Beth McAteer-Margolis: know the first Baptist Church has frequent meetings there I think on a daily basis during like the nine to five times so and of course we have businesses there so and a lot of people park there so I just would want to make sure that you were aware of that and able to accommodate those patrons of the

▶ 29:26 Speaker 10: businesses and the church I believe there is no parking in front of right the construction is which which is which has been it is on the other side of the street but they

▶ 29:38 Speaker 1: should not be impacted by this so okay thank you thank you alderman mortimer thank you very much

▶ 29:40 Peter D. Mortimer: president khan um could we kind of formalize the idea i don't think it rises to the level of a friendly amendment as alderman wright had said and i think we should make sure on alderman's right just as a friendly comment is that that the conduit itself will be large enough that in the future if pipes need to run through there that there'll be room for the city of melrose cables as well what is the diameter of the pipes they'll be four inches four inches and would that be enough mr street for additional cables to be fished through if the need should arise in the future

▶ 30:17 Speaker 10: i think that would depend on how much conduit you plan to put in each of those pipes is that

▶ 30:22 Speaker 9: well we'll be putting four four four inch pipes and um we'll only be taking use of one of them immediately so we'll have three open pipes for anything that you know may arise

▶ 30:37 Peter D. Mortimer: does that meet your satisfaction mr street i would think we could work something out yeah

▶ 30:39 Speaker 10: isn't that say we'll continue this discussion uh i mean myself and mike will to there'll still be

▶ 30:45 Peter D. Mortimer: be enough for us yeah the need to rise in the future and then on to the servicing the local businesses mr. and mrs. Quinn have a big stake here with their business can we guarantee that they'll always be some path to the front

▶ 31:05 Speaker 9: door of their business yeah I think that's definitely doable yeah all right

▶ 31:08 Peter D. Mortimer: so we'll guarantee that there'll always be some path to the front of their And would it be allowable, without having to go through the building, Commissioner, that they could always put a sign out that's open for business? They could put a sign out there, could you design a sign, maybe a sandwich board or something so your business doesn't get hurt? Would that be permissible that it wouldn't be in the way of construction that remain open for business and you could paint it up nicely? the painting you've done in your shop and it's very beautiful looks like you have some time well that's that's all that's on my next list of questions when would you expect this uh

▶ 31:50 Speaker 9: work to start um i don't have an exact date i would hope for october uh not much later because

▶ 31:59 Peter D. Mortimer: then the moratorium starts right so and how long would you expect that the work would take um it

▶ 32:02 Speaker 9: would probably take a day to go across the street and maybe um a day to lay all the pipe and pour the concrete and then maybe one more day to repair a couple days to repair so what was that four or

▶ 32:18 Peter D. Mortimer: five yeah four days four days yeah and will they all be weekdays yes yeah all right and that's probably you probably get most of your business on the weekends more i'm just guessing or is it even

▶ 32:47 Speaker 1: all right right yeah though if we could take a timeout here okay we're not really creating a great public record with everybody speaking at the same time I think we need to have one person talking at once yeah I mean we can make

▶ 32:57 Speaker 9: uh we can send out notifications letting people know what day it will happen what you know how long it will last and you know at what times you know our crews will be out there that's definitely

▶ 33:10 Speaker 10: something we can do i'll continue to work with them to get as much advanced notice as possible

▶ 33:13 Peter D. Mortimer: as well right and if you could both put in your notes please the brevity keep the operation as brief as possible access to the front door and make sure there's a place for a sign that says open for business remains open for business during construction uh that would be very very excuse me very beneficial uh to the business that seems will be most affected by this thank you very much gentlemen thank you mr thank you that's all i have

▶ 33:42 Robert A. Boisselle: on the map that you see on the screen here uh and on the map that you submitted you have icon for manholes has squares and are we looking at four manholes at this point and the three of them are right in the front of the business that we're talking

▶ 34:03 Speaker 9: about here yeah so we're talking four manholes but the manholes are existing

▶ 34:07 Robert A. Boisselle: they're not new so are you going to reconstruct them in any way or no we'll

▶ 34:10 Speaker 9: just be you know it all will be as an open manhole cover and our guys inside there'll be no construction around the manhole okay so there's no construction at all right well I mean there'll be construction to the manhole but not we're not reconstructing a manholes we're not installing manholes those are all existing structures that are already there so if they're already there we go

▶ 34:33 Robert A. Boisselle: down the manhole you're accepting what's there now right but um what we don't

▶ 34:41 Speaker 9: there's no spare pipes going to those manholes as of now which is why we're trying to basically

▶ 34:50 Robert A. Boisselle: digging around the manholes from manhole to manhole right we're digging between them and you're not changing any manhole structure itself okay thank you i was just going to add that those

▶ 35:01 Speaker 10: three are actually further down from from dorothy's lane the business here they're they're

▶ 35:09 Robert A. Boisselle: in that first well i'm just looking at the map in the way that so yeah it looks as though all three of them are right in there right in their front door thank you mr chairman thank you gentlemen

▶ 35:22 Monica C. Medeiros: any further discussion alderman Medeiros thank you i just want to stress too that perhaps uh well that the idea of a sandwich board is in opposition to our signed bylaws so that that perhaps public works speaks with uh the building department prior to this and that this is would be allowed for this purpose but not on i don't want to set the impression that that's allowed by us in general because I know that it is against the sign ordinance do you

▶ 35:53 Monica C. Medeiros: expect that there'll be other construction going on in the city at

▶ 35:59 Speaker 10: that time not in that area yes but not in that area not in that area so it

▶ 36:06 Speaker 10: won't detours heading I'm sorry there's the potential the Lebanon Street project is still pending and looming I'll have actually more information about that later this week but as a schedule sits now no there shouldn't be any other work and regarding the signage I'm sure I could work with National Grid as well to even if it's a construction sign business is open I mean those are common during during construction projects we could work something out there as well

▶ 36:29 Monica C. Medeiros: certainly if they you know I hate to see this this business owner spend money on something just for this period if if there is something existence that maybe national grid has that we can use or or something like that um and and yes just to keep that in mind that if we're having a detour for instance off of lebanon street that that might very well affect this this intersection and you know again please try to minimize that and get rid of the second poll as soon as possible thank you alden trim and tozy thank you mr president obviously the goal is

▶ 37:02 John N. Tramontozzi: to minimize the destruction in the area as much as possible i i think it's it's incumbent upon verizon um as well as um the public works department to at least notify the butters when the work is about to begin uh in a time frame that the work is going to take that's that's fair and i know mr street that you've been it's been great in the past when you've sent out notices to us as a board as well as to the butters in the community where projects are being done waterworks projects and so forth I think it makes a big difference in the community as a whole appreciates that maybe we can do something like this let's start a tradition of doing that in cooperation with Verizon just you know a simple flyer to the butters that the work is going to begin on such-and-such a date and makes and I would caution Verizon make sure you're accurate in your timetable because it'll only up open up a can of worms if you are not when the work is to begin and when the work is going to end so there's at least some prior knowledge for the butters and they can prepare accordingly additionally besides the you know the need for to minimize the disruption we also want to be certain that any construction that is done on the public sidewalks and the public property is repaired and I noticed I missed the street in accordance with your memorandum dated August 18 2014 I think there's a typo I think you said 2015 but that is a man you put forth five conditions that you place on this project and I noticed in one of them number three especially the sidewalks area that's disturbed during the construction shall be replaced from the back of the crib to the back of the sidewalk so is Verizon sir mr. representative Verizon are you prepared this is national grids petition oh I'm sorry what am I saying I sorry about that National Grid are you prepared to accept the conditions as outlined in the August 18th memorandum yes good so we'll make that part of the yeah the record as well all right I guess I was just making comments I wasn't asking a question but thank you that's all anything further

▶ 39:28 Speaker 1: chair would entertain a motion to conclude the public hearing so moved Alderman Mortimer moves to conclude the public hearing the motion seconded by Alderman Inferno on the motion all those in favor anyone opposed public hearing

▶ 39:40 Speaker 8: is hereby concluded the order is before you

▶ 39:48 Francis X. Wright Jr.: Alderman Wright thank you mr. president I would move to amend the order to include mr. streets memorandum of this date August 18th which sets forth five conditions and I would add to that a six condition which would read that national grid its successors and assigns shall hereby allow the city an ongoing opportunity to install cable through this conduit second the motion to amend

▶ 40:19 Speaker 1: alderman right moves to amend the grant of location to incorporate mr. streets five comments has set forth in his memorandum of today's date and he also adds a sixth condition to require national good to allow the city to utilize the conduit motion is seconded by Alderman Mortimer is their discussion

▶ 40:45 Speaker 1: relative to the motion all those in favor of the amendment indicate by saying aye anyone opposed motion to amend passes the order as amended is

▶ 41:01 Speaker 1: before you motion for passage Alderman Mortimer moves for passage of the order as amended second seconded by Alderman Boyce L any discussion on the motion all those in favor of passage of the order as amended indicate by saying aye anyone opposed motion passes the amended order is passed by the board of alderman thank you gentlemen

▶ 41:26 Speaker 1: thank you are there any orders out of order this evening we still have one more